1964 rear end swap

[MericaMopar]

I know this has been asked before, but is there a definitive first hand experience direct bolt in swap for these axles? I have been searching locally for a while now and the best i have come across is a 67-69 imperial rear end that is 46 1/8 center to center on the springs and 55 5/8 flange to flange. My measurements on mine are 45.5” center to center on the springs and around 56 flange to flange. Would that swap work and be fine if each spring is pushed out roughly 3/8 of an inch?

A lot of the swap charts i have found are missing data for 63/64 or do not match up with my measurements which just makes it more confusing.

Thanks

 

[Big_John]

I don't have an answer for you, but I'll tell you some of those charts out on the intrawebs have some errors, so a tape measure is your best friend.

Am I safe to assume that you want to change the rear for one without tapered axles?

 

[Big_John]

55 5/8 flange to flange

56 flange to flange

Would that swap work and be fine if each spring is pushed out roughly 3/8 of an inch?

Actually, that's only 3/16" on each side. Gotta split that 3/8" I think that would work OK.

Thinking about this... I have the rear out of my '65... I'll wander out to the garage and take a couple measurements.

 

[Big_John]

I couldn't get a good measurement because the center section is still in, but I think it's pretty close to your measurements. Around 56 1/2" and 46". Those are rough measurements because I had to bend the tape around the center.

I gotta pull the center section out, hopefully tomorrow, and I can get a better measurement then...

 

[MericaMopar]

I don't have an answer for you, but I'll tell you some of those charts out on the intrawebs have some errors, so a tape measure is your best friend.

Am I safe to assume that you want to change the rear for one without tapered axles?

Absolutely, the last time i had to touch the rear brakes it was a multiple day fight.

 

[MericaMopar]

Actually, that's only 3/16" on each side. Gotta split that 3/8" I think that would work OK.

Thinking about this... I have the rear out of my '65... I'll wander out to the garage and take a couple measurements.

Thats that axle housing flanges difference. The spring perch center line would be going from 45.5 to 46.125 which is 5/8 difference, so actually 5/16 each side that the leaf packs would be pushed out.

 

[Big_John]

Thats that axle housing flanges difference. The spring perch center line would be going from 45.5 to 46.125 which is 5/8 difference, so actually 5/16 each side that the leaf packs would be pushed out.

Oops. I did the math right, but used the wrong dimensions.

But I don't think 5/16" would make much difference.

 

[MericaMopar]

Oops. I did the math right, but used the wrong dimensions.

But I don't think 5/16" would make much difference.

that’s what i am thinking to. Picking it up this weekend and will report back once it’s in, probably once there isn’t a heatwave going on.

 

[gyknot]

Keep in mind, the Imperial will have a different wheel bolt circle. I'm sure there is something better than doing that.

 

[MericaMopar]

Keep in mind, the Imperial will have a different wheel bolt circle. I'm sure there is something better than doing that.

Ah jeez I overlooked that. Why does it have to be an oddball 5x5 instead of 5x4.5!

 

[MericaMopar]

I found c body axle shafts, but they are 1/4” shorter than the imperial shafts from the imperial rear end, is that an issue? Do the axle shafts have to be the perfect length to function? I can see to long being an issue.

Should add, the c body axles already have the green bearings installed on them.

 

[1970FuryConv]

Would a later B-body axle housing have the correct spring perches?
Breaking the factory welds for the spring seats, grinding off all the metal, and welding the seats back onto the axle seems like a lot of work.

 

[rags]

Breaking the factory welds for the spring seats, grinding off all the metal, and welding the seats back onto the axle seems like a lot of work.

that's how i put a 9 inch ford in my '69. for people who do a lot of cutting and welding it's childs play. in this situation i'd take ten and put a porta-power between the springs just to see what happens. that's even less work but could be havoc on the bushings over time.

 

[MericaMopar]

that's how i put a 9 inch ford in my '69. for people who do a lot of cutting and welding it's childs play. in this situation i'd take ten and put a porta-power between the springs just to see what happens. that's even less work but could be havoc on the bushings over time.

Would you preheat the housing before welding new perches on to help prevent warping?

I’m going to just try them as is first and see how it fits.

 

[1970FuryConv]

that's how i put a 9 inch ford in my '69. for people who do a lot of cutting and welding it's childs play. in this situation i'd take ten and put a porta-power between the springs just to see what happens. that's even less work but could be havoc on the bushings over time.

I agree that expanding the springs outward 5/16" each side might wreak havoc on the bushings overtime. Have you done that and had the springs lay flat on the perches? Thanks!

 

[rags]

Have you done that and had the springs lay flat on the perches? Thanks!

no, i've never had occasion to try it. i'm thinking that when the u-bolts are tightened that they would definitely pull the springs flat to the perches. the weak spots are the bushings. the springs would want to twist and walk over on the fronts. probably twist the shackles. the shackles could bent offset at the tops and bottoms cold with a couple of pipe wrenches. an X could be welded in for strength.


for the ten minutes it would take to set the porta-power up it would be worth it to try just to see if it's livable. drop the housing on the springs and sread 'em 'till the pins drop in. it might not be that bad.

Would you preheat the housing before welding new perches on to help prevent warping?

definitely not. it doesn't take a lot of heat to weld perches on. i'ts not something you'd do with a 110 mig though. my little 220 century was enough to handle it. put everything in place, set your pinion angle, and buzz it. easy-peasy.

 

[gyknot]

Have you ever considered slotting the hole in the pad with a carbide grinder? They cut steel very well.
I've never done it and not sure its an option, but seems it would be better than putting things into a bind.

 

[MericaMopar]

Have you ever considered slotting the hole in the pad with a carbide grinder? They cut steel very well.
I've never done it and not sure its an option, but seems it would be better than putting things into a bind.

I was thinking that could be an option if i needed to do that, the nuts on my spring packs are a fair bit smaller than the holes on the spring perches on the axle currently in the car, so realistically it’s less than 5/16 of flex on each side.

 

[MericaMopar]

no, i've never had occasion to try it. i'm thinking that when the u-bolts are tightened that they would definitely pull the springs flat to the perches. the weak spots are the bushings. the springs would want to twist and walk over on the fronts. probably twist the shackles. the shackles could bent offset at the tops and bottoms cold with a couple of pipe wrenches. an X could be welded in for strength.


for the ten minutes it would take to set the porta-power up it would be worth it to try just to see if it's livable. drop the housing on the springs and sread 'em 'till the pins drop in. it might not be that bad.

definitely not. it doesn't take a lot of heat to weld perches on. i'ts not something you'd do with a 110 mig though. my little 220 century was enough to handle it. put everything in place, set your pinion angle, and buzz it. easy-peasy.

Hm, might be a good excuse to upgrade my welder, i just have a Hobart handler 140. I’ve built a trailer with it and haven’t had any issues with the welds so far.

 

[Just Carbs]

I have a 64 C New Yorker.
Very not happy with the hub/drum marriage deal.
Fine with the tapered axle/tapered hub part.
Separated the hub from drum, used 72 New Yorker rear drum ($45) and lugs on 64 tapered rear hub.
Hub, drum and wheel still hub centric.
Very happy now.
But will keep 64 housing and use bolt in axles and 3.55 posi chunk from later C when shows up.