For Sale 72 monaco

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The ad I saw on Facebook for this car mentioned a pissed off ex starting the fire.

Real shame no matter what happened.

Depending on what pieces are left, like the tail lights and road wheels, $1800 is a pretty good place to start.
 
The ad I saw on Facebook for this car mentioned a pissed off ex starting the fire.

Aw man, now you make me want to join the devil's privacy-invasion and propaganda machine, just so I can read that story...
 
Don't do it Carmine, I'm sure you'd regret it.
 
Do not look into the Abyss. It will be impossible to look away and you'll be drawn into it and closely monitored by the U.S. and Russia.
 
Aw man, now you make me want to join the devil's privacy-invasion and propaganda machine, just so I can read that story...

Don't do it Carmine, I'm sure you'd regret it.

Do not look into the Abyss. It will be impossible to look away and you'll be drawn into it and closely monitored by the U.S. and Russia.

Yea, but you'll be able to see pictures of puppies and get recipes for cookies and stuff like that.
 
I go to Pinterest for that... :p
Facebook is like everything else.... It all depends on what you do with it. Mrs. Big John loves the politics. Me, I like the jokes and I get to see some pics of my grand kids.

The folks in our town have a couple groups that are there to inform you what is going on locally. I really like that. There's at least one good C-body group and a bunch of Mopar groups.

I think it all depends on what you put out there... I don't take it seriously.
 
The ad I saw on Facebook for this car mentioned a pissed off ex starting the fire.

Real shame no matter what happened.

Depending on what pieces are left, like the tail lights and road wheels, $1800 is a pretty good place to start.


Just another guy trying to draw attention to themselves and get a bunch of likes on Facebook. You can't even say what really happened people just ignore the truth and keep going on how the EX girlfriend should be.....


Dave
 
Just another guy trying to draw attention to themselves and get a bunch of likes on Facebook. You can't even say what really happened people just ignore the truth and keep going on how the EX girlfriend should be.....


Dave
That's very possible. I don't know the people involved.
 
I know the truth isn't as exciting as insurance fraud or an ex girlfriend torching your car or a combination of the two but I went into pretty good detail what actually happened and there was already one link to it on this thread:

For Sale - Nice 1972 Monaco 2 Door for Sale

Dave

"The owner was driving it to work and his best guess is that when he turn on the blower motor the poor thing caught fire and spread too fast for him to do anything about it. The car is an insurance write-off and should be at an auction sometime soon in Michigan near Detroit."

You're right, not as exciting as the stripper I'd heard he picked up, and that she'd caught it on fire just by being unlawfully hot.

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I believe what Dave has said as the culprit in this case and probably most other under dash fires. I have seen so many under dash connectors on C bodies with a/c that are melted and burned, it is a seriously weak link on these cars. The insufficient gauge of the wiring and any built up corrosion in the fuse box junction, other poor electrical connections or poor condition blower switches all combined probably are the most likely source of these fires. Those blower switches are just junk, and I would go as far as to say the poorest design aspect of any fuselage C body at least is the pathetically cheap electrical systems that won't go the distance. It is what makes the heavily option loaded Imperials such a nuisance to keep running with everything working.

It is no wonder that GM clobbered Chrysler in the market place in those years. Their a/c systems in general were 10 times better than Chrysler's pathetic rumbling a/c systems and the poor margin engine cooling systems in Chrysler products didn't help at all either. GM had smooth rotary compressors and large evaporators with high output blower fans and cross flow radiators much better suited particularly to cooling well in traffic on hot days due to their much greater width needed to address that problem. Imperials had 28" wide radiators which helped a little, but all other Chryslers with a/c had the meager 26" radiators that couldn't do the job in places like Arizona or California.

The two things that caused me to leave Chrysler was their "cheap think" over good performance when designing systems and the unions that were out of control in terms of allowing anything to get done in an efficient manner. I found the engineers were generally very capable, but the managers of the various departments were focused insanely on cost reduction and looked mostly at their prospects for a promotion based on how much money they saved in their departments rather than achieving the best possible product at reasonable cost. After these "successful" managers got promoted, they went on further in the company to higher levels while the junk they put into production and its associated problems landed in the lap of the next poor sucker that took the promoted manager's job. It was shameful as I was seeing it first hand and the bankruptcy that landed in circa 1980 was easily seen coming.
 
The two things that caused me to leave Chrysler was their "cheap think" over good performance when designing systems and the unions that were out of control in terms of allowing anything to get done in an efficient manner. I found the engineers were generally very capable, but the managers of the various departments were focused insanely on cost reduction and looked mostly at their prospects for a promotion based on how much money they saved in their departments rather than achieving the best possible product at reasonable cost. After these "successful" managers got promoted, they went on further in the company to higher levels while the junk they put into production and its associated problems landed in the lap of the next poor sucker that took the promoted manager's job. It was shameful as I was seeing it first hand and the bankruptcy that landed in circa 1980 was easily seen coming.
Unfortunately I have seen that in every high-volume mfg place I have ever worked. The only difference I'd say is that now the engineers aren't as capable as before. Young guys use them 'puters and re-awaken problems the old dudes solved years before (while smoking in the building, I might add).
 
Unfortunately I have seen that in every high-volume mfg place I have ever worked. The only difference I'd say is that now the engineers aren't as capable as before. Young guys use them 'puters and re-awaken problems the old dudes solved years before (while smoking in the building, I might add).

You have to realize (as I eventually did) that saforwardlook keeps complaints about electrical systems, AC compressors and management in a Word document to cut/paste when ever he gets a chance. I think it's the file next to the one about how Michigan's cold winter weather makes us all gloomy racists.

While I would be the first to admit those blower switches aren't military-grade, I have also rotated through a LOT of survivor Mopars, and most of these parts work without issue, nearly 50 years later. As with anything, there are failures. I really don't get the "cooling problem" complaint after driving many a vintage Mopar through genuine deserts. Pretty much if you can get through the I-17 Bumble Bee grade in July, you can go anywhere, and I've done it many times in a dozen different survivor cars with zero issue.

But anyway, there is an expression that goes like this... "you don't know what you don't know." There should be another that says "you only know what you know". I work with guys that can point out every issue on a particular car, and then insist these issues don't exist elsewhere. Or that their pet issue is the only one that needs to be addressed.

That's not an "excuse" not to care, but some of them become a real drag on the group until morale gets so bad they have to be asked to leave. I have no delusions it doesn't happen everywhere, because it's basically human nature.

When you consider the much-lower-than GM/Ford production number, normal attrition and the attack from all sides (mother nature, derbies, engine pullers, etc.) I actually think the C-body survival rate must surpass brand G and F full sizers.
 
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I know the truth isn't as exciting as insurance fraud or an ex girlfriend torching your car or a combination of the two but I went into pretty good detail what actually happened and there was already one link to it on this thread:

For Sale - Nice 1972 Monaco 2 Door for Sale

Dave
I can't find the post on FB that I read.

I did find the owner's post about the fire in a C body group from October. The ex girlfriend claim is being floated on other groups and not by the owner. I can't find those posts, so it may be possible that they've been pulled.

I don't understand why people do these things...
 
You have to realize (as I eventually did) that saforwardlook keeps complaints about electrical systems, AC compressors and management in a Word document to cut/paste when ever he gets a chance. I think it's the file next to the one about how Michigan's cold winter weather makes us all gloomy racists.

While I would be the first to admit those blower switches aren't military-grade, I have also rotated through a LOT of survivor Mopars, and most of these parts work without issue, nearly 50 years later. As with anything, there are failures. I really don't get the "cooling problem" complaint after driving many a vintage Mopar through genuine deserts. Pretty much if you can get through the I-17 Bumble Bee grade in July, you can go anywhere, and I've done it many times in a dozen different survivor cars with zero issue.

But anyway, there is an expression that goes like this... "you don't know what you don't know." There should be another that says "you only know what you know". I work with guys that can point out every issue on a particular car, and then insist these issues don't exist elsewhere. Or that their pet issue is the only one that needs to be addressed.

That's not an "excuse" not to care, but some of them become a real drag on the group until morale gets so bad they have to be asked to leave. I have no delusions it doesn't happen everywhere, because it's basically human nature.

When you consider the much-lower-than GM/Ford production number, normal attrition and the attack from all sides (mother nature, derbies, engine pullers, etc.) I actually think the C-body survival rate must surpass brand G and F full sizers.


My goal was to inform anyone who might be unaware that the a/c related wiring can be a fire hazard and perhaps another regrettable fire can be avoided. And you are offended at it? My observations are based first hand in saving, fixing and selling a lot of cars over the years, and observing other makes as well. I was also present in the engineering staff of the Corporation from 1969 - 1981 and had to do a lot of competitive evaluation of other makes of vehicles in that period. If you have more experience, great, and if you don't like to read what you consider repetitive comments then you are free to skip what I have to say. There are new members on this board every day that may not have seen my comments before and may be unaware of this hazard.

As for your comment "I think it's the file next to the one about how Michigan's cold winter weather makes us all gloomy racists.", I have no idea what you are talking about? Just because I don't support some of your conservative views and I am not keen on Trump, don't put words in my mouth or try to disparage me. I try to be upbeat nearly all of the time, but once in awhile, maybe too often for your incredible self, it is too much if I make a negative comment on some of Chrysler's faults as I have experienced them (I obviously believe they have many numerous advantages since I very much support their cars overall and have quite a lot of them - of all the car companies, they have been my favorites since I was 9 years old).

If you think I am a drag on the group who should be asked to leave, then all I can say is you have an incredible ego if you think your acrid tongue is a delight to all of us. You obviously have a lot of knowledge, which I do respect, but because I don't share your political views, then I should not be your target. If your skin is so thin that you can't take an intelligent opposing view of politics, then you have some soul searching to do. This is just another reason I really do wish that subject was not a part of a site like this. You have been on this site for less than 2 years apparently but already you are suggesting who should be expelled and who should stay. I have been on this site since 2011 and I have never, ever had a comment like yours sent to me publicly or privately. And I have enjoyed this site a great deal over the years and try to contribute where I can in a respectful, helpful, considerate, and interesting way. And I have a lot of friends on this site and some who know me personally and have visited me too and I believe they would not share your narrow opinions of me.

Maybe you need to just lighten up - look at this video and see if you can laugh a little (and she wasn't my first choice either!)

Louis C.K.: We need a mom as president - CNN Video

Now, lets get back on track.....................peace
 
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My goal was to inform anyone who might be unaware that the a/c related wiring can be a fire hazard and perhaps another regrettable fire can be avoided. And you are offended at it?

As for your comment "I think it's the file next to the one about how Michigan's cold winter weather makes us all gloomy racists.", I have no idea what you are talking about? Just because I don't support some of your conservative views and I am not keen on Trump, don't put words in my mouth or try to disparage me...

...

Rest assured that your political views hadn't at all occurred to me when I read your most recent pompous windbag comments. But if you want an idea what I'm talking about, here are three examples...

All I can say is that I hated living in the suburbs of Detroit for the entire 3 years I was there. The incredible cold, gloom and factory town atmosphere was too much for me, but I grew up in Southern California...

In California, I see very little racism, as people here just plain get along very well and skin color has little importance (I live in a typical middle class town). You can walk into a restaurant and see school kids after a sports game celebrating their win that evening, and to watch them is enlightening. The kids are a total mixture of races, with white kids not a big plurality. They laugh, have great fun and get along great, and they obviously care nothing about color... We very much understand the importance of technology innovation to be the center of job creation and economic growth (witness silicon valley). The weather also helps.

...our economies are generally pretty good, with emphasis on new technology development, very good schools and universities, lots of job opportunities and a popuation that supports fighting global warming and a democratic base. Racisism is also minimal and people here get along pretty well in part probably because the economy is good.

I think we all get it. You were miserable in Michigan and you fell back in love with the enlightened peoples of Southern California. No one in Detroit or at Chrysler recognized your brilliance and you should have been promoted.

I'm NOT AT ALL suggesting that you should leave; you're my back up man for not chopping up original cars. But realize that you can scarcely get through a posting about a high-resistance switch fault in a 45-year-old car without reminding the world how things would have been different if only more people listened to you. You offered me a good measure of advice in your reply, so I'll repay the favor... Realize that cost-cutting occurs in all industries, and among all companies. If that weren't the case, space shuttle o-rings wouldn’t fail and Takata airbags wouldn't kill Honda drivers. Re-telling your stories from 35+ years ago as if no one has encountered anything similar isn't offensive, it's just tiresome. I'm also pretty sure the song "F**K the Police", Rodney King and the Sacramento shooter are all California products, so vitamin D doesn't solve everything.

If you really wanted to prevent fires, a simply written piece of advice that said "check your wiring in high amperage circuits for signs of overheating and guard against corroded/hi-resistance connections" would suffice; absent complaints about unions, who got promoted, your feelings regarding bankruptcy (which didn't actually occur), etc. As long as connections are clean and no other faults (like a stalled electric motor) are present, there isn't really a design problem or most of our cars would have been long gone before the 40-year mark.

Honestly, I don't have any issue with people offering their opinions so long as they don't object to having them challenged.
 
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Picking excerpts out of context from what I have said in the past and then stringing them into a whole different reality is what lawyers do to win their case with the unknowing. Good job.

I never said people in the cold portions of the country are racists like you impugned to me. Rather, my point of that thread was that when all the spoils in this country go to the top, that creates misery at the bottom of the ladder, and then racial tensions become inevitable, and more so when the weather is so cold that their lives are more at risk. If a state is run well and its citizens are active participants in the political process and watch closely what their congressmen are doing and whose interests they are really serving, and vote accordingly, there would be less problems in that state. The other point was that if you see your job for which you are trained going away, maybe it is time for you to take the initiative to retrain yourself to be more useful to people that are hiring. Self driving trucks and cars are coming, for example, so if you drive a truck or cab, maybe it is time to invest in yourself and get retrained for something else (but I still have my doubts about how fast they will really be here). I don't think it is necessarily government's responsibility to bring back jobs that are obsolete anymore. That was what I was trying to say about the need for good schools, a good economy where, as in California, taxes on the wealthy are higher to represent their fair share, and everything just works better. I posted an article that I saw today, based on thoughts of a Bush administration official on global trade, that echos much the same thoughts as I have had if you care to look at it.

No I am not a fan of cold weather, but I also realize there are folks that hate hot climates and never ending traffic, so they hate California and Arizona, for example. And I realize there are folks that love the change in seasons and less crowds, and snow, skiing, etc. It never bothers me one bit if someone doesn't like California, as I am a proponent of living where you like it best. But if you are so bothered by my reaction to the midwestern climate in a couple posts in the past, then my apologies if my comments sent you over the top. I didn't say anything about the climate in the post you used to attack me.

I never worked for Chrysler that long, as I hired in as a student in the Chrysler Institute of Engineering in 1969 and they paid for and put me through grad school. So I was never there long enough to even think about being promoted to managment. And I really had no illusion that any manager would even care what I thought - I was just pointing out my observations from a historical perspective. What bothered me the longer I stayed was watching poor decisions by managment that brought a once great company that I loved, eventually to bankruptcy. If you don't build a good car, you won't succeed and you can cut costs only so much before you lose customers. Chrysler went into bankruptcy for two reasons - poor managment decisions and out of control unions.

You say you have worked on a lot of Chrysler products, OK, so why is it that even though the many cars I have bought over the years (mostly 1969 - 73), which have been low mileage rust free cars, that the electrical systems have a bunch of problems on every one of them: failed power window switches and motors, failed head light door motors, failed blower switches, power seat switches with buttons broken off, 3 speed wiper motors that won't park, rheostats that either won't allow the instrument panel lights to come on or to be dimmed, clocks that never work (my forward look cars even have clocks that worked for a long time), electric door lock solenoids that never work, radios and tape players that don't work, auto temp systems that were nothing but a nightmare, - need I go on? This stuff failed early on and just sent customers to other manufacturers' cars. I found it painful to see all this going on, and then with the formals the number of complaints that were coming in due to lean burn systems and poor reliabilty of the electrical related systems were out of control. California even made Chrysler recall the 318 - 2 bbl cars in 1977 because when they did confirmatory tests on them for emission compliance, they routinely stalled 4 - 5 times in trying to run the CVS compliance test around 72F and couldn't even complete the tests successfully. The task to fix them fell on me since the proving ground told me flat out "California is the land of fruits and nuts, so who cares about them" So I did the best I could with the stuff the proving grounds released to production for California so Chrysler could still sell Aspens and Volares etc. but my bosses didn't want to spend a dime to really do it right. Some folks on this site have asked me in the past to express some of my observations on the demise of the company from my first hand experience. However, this apparently for some reason troubles you. You don't have to read it if you saw it once before. I like books like the one on Exner that helped tell the story of what really went on back in the day and it seems others do as well.

You apparently are easily angered and have to unleash it for some reason on me, but I am confident you will find someone else to rail on in the future, and then mess up this site like Moparts since you said you were familiar with getting people banned from other sites because they were so negative. And you did imply that my comments were offensive enough that maybe I should be banned. Your attacking me will not deter my freedom to express my thoughts in a respectful and considerate manner, as I have done on this site a long time now without being railed on by anyone like you that just has to stir up the pot unnecessarily for reasons unknown to me. I really will not reply to any further postings by you on this subject. I would rather just move on.

Bush economist warns: Be 'very afraid' about globalization's next phase
 
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