Anything else kill a 5 year old battery?

Zymurgy

Zymurgy

Old Man with a Hat
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Took Goldie out for breakfast and wouldn't start after words. I got a jump and drove her home. I thought the alternator was dead and I was running on just the battery. My alternator gauge seemed OK, except reading more to the left than normal. It would read slightly to the right of center at speed and would be pretty much dead center when coming to a stop.

Alternator was tested 3 times, and I watched him do, it and passed every time. Now I decided it must be the battery. My charger wouldn't charge it and came up as an error, bad battery. Autozone confirmed it was bad too.

Here is my question is there anything in the system that could damage the battery? The dead battery threw me, because it always turns over so easily and then it was dead. Did not even have a slow turn over before.

I said when this battery died I would buy a period correct battery, that is still the plan, but I have to order that battery and don't want to damage a new battery, when I can't just drive into town and replace. Anything else I should look for, I have a spare boat battery I can run in the short run.
 
Cold, Heat, vibration, overcharging right off the top of my head. But 5 years is about whatcha get these days. Even the OEMs say to replace their batteries after 5.
 
Just went thru this on my mower. 5yr old batt, started like it always has, pulled into the shop to sharpen the blades, oil change, etc. Finished up maintenance, 2 hrs later, go to start it, and its absolutely dead, showed good voltage too. When the key was turned nada , zip. Replaced some common switches that typically go out, which didn't fix the trouble. Then I replaced the battery, starts great now. Good luck
 
Put your spare battery in and see what the alternator is putting out. 5 yrs is about right. I have seen some last longer but they are driven every day.
 
Zymurgy said:
I said when this battery died I would buy a period correct battery, that is still the plan, but I have to order that battery and don't want to damage a new battery, when I can't just drive into town and replace.
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As nice as Goldie is, I do understand the fake authentic battery would look great when the hood is up.

If you are more practically minded about replacements in the future, I'd just go with what's available. Batteries can and do poop out at any time. Viv's DD just puked this week at 3 years old, that was a fun early morning. 5 years is doing good, a few will go longer and lots will go shorter. Sometimes they don't make it the first year too.
 
65sporty said:
Put your spare battery in and see what the alternator is putting out. 5 yrs is about right. I have seen some last longer but they are driven every day.
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My daily driver get used about 2 times a week runnin errands and I'm pushing 9 years on that batt. I guess it all depends on how much use it gets, how often you fire it up?
It sounds like the Alt. is good so your looking at the batt., don't forget to look at the Regulator as well. I have never liked the little black box that Mopar used, but yet people swear by them, I would rather use the modern set up shown here. charging system overview
Okay so it's not period correct but it's still Mopar, and I have been very satisfied with who much more effective charging I have over the old system on both my 300 and my A100 van. Good Luck with whatever the problem is.
 
Great info thanks guys. It seems like something else might be up. I have had issues with the voltage regulator in the past. Will definitely read up on the article.
 
Zymurgy said:
Great info thanks guys. It seems like something else might be up. I have had issues with the voltage regulator in the past. Will definitely read up on the article.
Click to expand...

Things like regulator or alternator issues tend to shorten the life of the battery.

But 5 years is pretty good, even without problems.
 
I think the original voltage regulator may be toast, after reading the article. I actually have a transistor type regulator on my shelf. I will install it hopefully tomorrow.
 
stubs300 said:
My daily driver get used about 2 times a week runnin errands and I'm pushing 9 years on that batt. I guess it all depends on how much use it gets, how often you fire it up?
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Thanks for the link Stubs. As to the battery speculation... it's a chemical battery... gentile charging/discharging cycles cause much less sulfation of the lead plates than deeper cycling. Extreme temperatures can be hard on it as well as shocks and vibrations.

I will admit to not being able to give a scientific explanation off the top of my head... but let it suffice when I say sometimes you just get lucky. Eventually you will have a plate fail, and the battery can not deliver it's rating... big or small margin doesn't matter when you can't trust it to start the car.

One thing I do like to have is removable caps... most newer batteries still have two caps which cover three cells each. Keep the top clean, and keep the cells full using only distilled water... it will help the battery survive and reduce the explosion risks. An exposed plate can arc and that may cause the battery to explode, funny how that has become lost knowledge over the years... even though most batteries still provide access.
 
Zymurgy said:
I think the original voltage regulator may be toast, after reading the article. I actually have a transistor type regulator on my shelf. I will install it hopefully tomorrow.
Click to expand...
If the battery has tested bad... you may have trouble with any other test results. Not saying don't make the change, but if it still seems to have trouble, wait for the new battery to decide what else is wrong.

A bigger issue with newer cars, this still can apply to the older ones... A vicious cycle starts when a component of the starting/charging system is weak. The battery is low, the alternator works harder... the alternator then is damaged.

The owner replaces the battery, then finds the alternator has failed... owner now thinks they wasted $$ on a battery, when they actually allowed the weak component to damage another component.

Same thing with starter motors, low voltage when cranking reduces the speed of the starter due to less current flow. This means the starter armature spins too slow or stalls and the current flow starts to weld the commutator bars. You can even damage a window motor making it work (holding the switch) if its operating too slow, same idea as the starter.

Too often by the time the car is getting repaired, the damage has been done. Then it's a "chicken and egg" discussion about the battery and alternator (or starter). As a rule, replace a weak battery ASAP... it saves a lot of hassle and more failed parts later.
 
cantflip said:
If the battery has tested bad... you may have trouble with any other test results. Not saying don't make the change, but if it still seems to have trouble, wait for the new battery to decide what else is wrong.

A bigger issue with newer cars, this still can apply to the older ones... A vicious cycle starts when a component of the starting/charging system is weak. The battery is low, the alternator works harder... the alternator then is damaged.

The owner replaces the battery, then finds the alternator has failed... owner now thinks they wasted $$ on a battery, when they actually allowed the weak component to damage another component.

Same thing with starter motors, low voltage when cranking reduces the speed of the starter due to less current flow. This means the starter armature spins too slow or stalls and the current flow starts to weld the commutator bars. You can even damage a window motor making it work (holding the switch) if its operating too slow, same idea as the starter.

Too often by the time the car is getting repaired, the damage has been done. Then it's a "chicken and egg" discussion about the battery and alternator (or starter). As a rule, replace a weak battery ASAP... it saves a lot of hassle and more failed parts later.
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All that plus the battery cables/terminals.

That seems to be something that gets addressed last after changing (rather than diagnosing) the rest of the charging/starting system and yet it's the cheapest component in the system.
 
I get 7 - 9 years out of my group 27 C body batteries (my record is 11 years), and I rarely daily drive them. Now on the other hand the batteries my daily drivers (Honda Fits) never last more than 5 years. Go figure...

My trick is to always put them on a trickle charger and diconnect the battery when the car sits. Whether it's just over night or a few weeks, it makes no difference, I always do it. That way the battery is fully charged and both the alternator and regulator don't have to work hard. My batteries always seem to last.

I think it has a lot to do with how much heavy charging the battery experiences... low level longer length trickle charging seems to work better than heavy level short length high amperage charging like an alternator puts out. I seem to remember hearing that less lead oxidizes off the plate when slow charged. More oxidation = shorter battery life.
 
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Ross Wooldridge said:
I get 7 - 9 years out of my group 27 C body batteries (my record is 11 years), and I rarely daily drive them. Now on the other hand the batteries my daily drivers (Honda Fits) never last more than 5 years. Go figure...

My trick is to always put them on a trickle charger and diconnect the battery when the car sits. Whether it's just over night or a few weeks, it makes no difference, I always do it. That way the battery is fully charged and both the alternator and regulator don't have to work hard. My batteries always seem to last.

I think it has a lot to do with how much heavy charging the battery experiences... low level longer length trickle charging seems to work better than heavy level short length high amperage charging like an alternator puts out. I seem to remember hearing that less lead oxidizes off the plate when slow charged. More oxidation = shorter battery life.
Click to expand...
The issue is the lead sulfates build up on the plates in discharge. Charging reverses the build up, but deep discharge lets too much sulfate build up. Fast charging a deep discharged battery doesn't dissolve the heavy buildup very well.

So what happens is you run the battery down, the plates get built up with a heavy coating. The car starts charging the battery quickly and the build up doesn't dissolve as it should. Do that a few times and the battery life will come up short.

How a battery works...

 
Problem solved thanks everyone for input, it was the voltage regulator. When I hooked up my voltmeter with my back-up battery it read 12.6 before I started, 12.2 with the engine running. I hooked up the new VR I had on the shelf it read 13.9 to 14.0. The gauge is reading right where it has in the past too. I turned my headlights on and the needle didn't budge, before I switched out the VR it actually dropped below center. I never took that reading with the voltmeter.

The bonus is I don't have to decide what kind of battery to buy at this time. I got my old one to take a charge today, it's days could be numbered but the voltage numbers were good. I got 12.8 volts at rest and 14.0 while running.
 
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