Steel Rims - 1969 Chrysler T&C Which to use? 7 inch or 7-1/2 inch width ?

[Sport Fury 67]

My wagon came with an extra set of tires/rims. I noticed that two pair are different. I want to get a second set of white wall tire 235/75R 15' mount them on these steel rims.

Before I get too far, can someone tell me if I can use these "as-is" or do I need to match all four - width wise.

One pair is 7-1/2 inches wide. They have the Chrysler logo by the valve stem. Stamped in the rim is 3580064 Other markings are 432 8

The second pair is 7 inches wide. No Mopar logo, a part number of 3580361 They appear to have "Kelsey" markings - K2 B3 M The only difference is these 7 inch wide rims have an extra hole. It reminds me of the rims on my 58 Plymouth which had this hole for a alignment on stud, located on the drum.

The center hole and lug spacings are the same on all four wheels.

Are the 7-1/2 for the front to account for the front disc brakes? Should I used these and put the 7-1/2 in front?

Any comments or suggestions would be appreciated.

 

[CBODY67]

The station wagon wheels, starting with the 1965 model year in 14" and continuing into the Fuselage years in 15" should have been 6.5" wide for either rim diameter. The normal "car" wheels were either 5.5" or 6.0" wide, no matter the rim diameter.

Rim width is measured BETWEEN the rim flanges, not outside of them. That probably is what has led to the wider dimensions quoted. Also, the rim diameters are stamped on the inside of the tire area, in the middle. As in "15x6.5JK".

For the C-body cars which would have required "HD Wheels", as in police vehicles and heavy-duty trailer towing cars, they had a special HD wheel for those applications, which was 6" wide, in 14" or 15", depending upon Slabs (14") or Fuselage cars. (15"). In those earlier times, a 6" wide wheel was considered "wide-base", as others were 5.5" or 5.0", in those times.

Why Chrysler chose the 6.5" rim rather than a 7.0" rim width, I don't know. The only time they used the 15x7 wheel specs were on the 15" Rallye Wheels on E-body, 1970-1973, IIRC, and on the later "cop car wheels", Magnum GT wheels, and a few years of W23 Road Wheels on Chrysler LeBaron "bent-bar cars" in the later 1970s.

The 15x7 Magnum GT wheels had a 15x8" cousin, which was on the Chrysler Kit Cars. The Magnum GT wheels had a special, rough metallic paint that was unique to that application. The 15x8s were normal smooth paint. Seems there was also some 15x8 wheels used on mid-'70s Dodge Ramchargers and Plymouth Trail Dusters?

There were also some 15x6.5" Rallye Wheels on the 1976 (maybe 1975 too) Dodge Charger SE. These wheels look just like the earlier 15x7 Rallye Wheels except not quite so deep and use the same center cap as the 14x5.5" Rallye Wheels on A and E-body cars.

I think that coveres it, IIRC.
CBODY67

 

[JMill67]

In 1970-1971, Chrysler also made plain steel 15x7 “450” wheels. Those wheels took the dog dish poverty cap. The 15x7 rallye wheels came on B and E bodies.

 

[CBODY67]

In 1970-1971, Chrysler also made plain steel 15x7 “450” wheels. Those wheels took the dog dish poverty cap. The 15x7 rallye wheels came on B and E bodies.

What applications did those wheels have?

2944450 (Painted) and 2944390 (Class 1 Rallye) are listed for E-body and B-body only, in 1970-71 Chrysler Parts Book in 15x7 size.

 

[JMill67]

Yes that’s true, but you said, “The only time they used the 15x7 wheel specs were on the 15" Rallye Wheels on E-body, 1970-1973,”

 

[Lefty71]

1970-1971, Chrysler also made plain steel 15x7 “450” wheels

What applications did those wheels have

Anyone know the part number for "safety wheels"??? They are the ones with no slots. I have one, it was OEM on a `71 2-door New Yorker. Tia

 

[CBODY67]

The non-Rallye 15x7s, in those earlier model years ('70-'71) were something I was not aware of, for decades. Until I found them in the parts book last night, I was not aware of them. As they were only on B/E-body cars, and all HEMI cars has 15" wheels, those non-Rallye 15x7s might have been the base wheel for non-Rallye HEMI cars, but I don't recall seeing that in road tests of back then . . . which can relate to what Chrysler put in their Press Fleets back then. Of which FEW were "low equipment level" cars

In further looking at the 1970 Barracuda A.M.A Specs document, the 15x7 non-Rallye wheels are optional on 383, 440, and 426HEMI C-body vehicles. I suspect that most dealers whould have wanted to "dress-up" the B/E-body cars with the 15x7 Rallyes and the required Polyglass White Letter tires, as somebody who wanted a "racer" would have not opted for those, choosing the standard 15x7 wheels at no cost. 15x7 Rallyes were the only 15x7 on 340 cars, according to this document.

Not sure why the solid wheels were termed "safety wheels". I believe they were model-year specific rather than not. Seems like the road tests of the then-new Fuselage 1969 C-body cars, Plymouth Fury specifically, indicated the cars had poor brake performance, which was not expected. I recall one reason was allegedly the solid steel wheels, with no "ventilation" slots or "handholds" in them. I remember similar comments on the B-body cars which had the finned Polycast optional wheels in the middle 1970s. How true these allegations were, I'm not sure, considering that most full wheel covers also had "no ventilation holes/slots" in them.

@Lefty71, in the 1970-71 Chrysler Parts Manual, as to 15x6 wheels, the listings for C-body wheels are "Painted, Painted-Heavy Duty, and Painted-Extra Heavy Duty" across P, D, and C models. Not sure about the physical differences between these three designations.

When the E-bodies were new, in the earlier 1970s, my main information sources were magazine road tests, magazine articles, and sales brochures. Parts books, I could look at at the local dealership parts dept. I did not discover the Order Guides until a few years later.

Back then, I liked the Challengers more than Barracudas. Mainly due to the more upscale level of Dodges in general and the longer wheelbase. Others liked the 'Cudas more for their lighter weight. The "grape" '70 Challenger R/T convertible which CAR LIFE tested seemed to have chunkier wheels and the factory wire wheel covers seemed to stick out more, but no mention of the wheels being 15x7s rather than 15x6s. So I made a mental note "No wire wheels covers on Challengers". I guess I need to dig out that road test and look at the specs page again.

Thanks @JMill67 for your comments, which made me get into the files and verify what I probably should have known about , but didn't.

Enjoy!
CBODY67

 

[rv2]

The non-Rallye 15x7s, in those earlier model years ('70-'71) were something I was not aware of, for decades. Until I found them in the parts book last night, I was not aware of them. As they were only on B/E-body cars, and all HEMI cars has 15" wheels, those non-Rallye 15x7s might have been the base wheel for non-Rallye HEMI cars, but I don't recall seeing that in road tests of back then . . . which can relate to what Chrysler put in their Press Fleets back then. Of which FEW were "low equipment level" cars

In further looking at the 1970 Barracuda A.M.A Specs document, the 15x7 non-Rallye wheels are optional on 383, 440, and 426HEMI C-body vehicles. I suspect that most dealers whould have wanted to "dress-up" the B/E-body cars with the 15x7 Rallyes and the required Polyglass White Letter tires, as somebody who wanted a "racer" would have not opted for those, choosing the standard 15x7 wheels at no cost. 15x7 Rallyes were the only 15x7 on 340 cars, according to this document.

Not sure why the solid wheels were termed "safety wheels". I believe they were model-year specific rather than not. Seems like the road tests of the then-new Fuselage 1969 C-body cars, Plymouth Fury specifically, indicated the cars had poor brake performance, which was not expected. I recall one reason was allegedly the solid steel wheels, with no "ventilation" slots or "handholds" in them. I remember similar comments on the B-body cars which had the finned Polycast optional wheels in the middle 1970s. How true these allegations were, I'm not sure, considering that most full wheel covers also had "no ventilation holes/slots" in them.

@Lefty71, in the 1970-71 Chrysler Parts Manual, as to 15x6 wheels, the listings for C-body wheels are "Painted, Painted-Heavy Duty, and Painted-Extra Heavy Duty" across P, D, and C models. Not sure about the physical differences between these three designations.

When the E-bodies were new, in the earlier 1970s, my main information sources were magazine road tests, magazine articles, and sales brochures. Parts books, I could look at at the local dealership parts dept. I did not discover the Order Guides until a few years later.

Back then, I liked the Challengers more than Barracudas. Mainly due to the more upscale level of Dodges in general and the longer wheelbase. Others liked the 'Cudas more for their lighter weight. The "grape" '70 Challenger R/T convertible which CAR LIFE tested seemed to have chunkier wheels and the factory wire wheel covers seemed to stick out more, but no mention of the wheels being 15x7s rather than 15x6s. So I made a mental note "No wire wheels covers on Challengers". I guess I need to dig out that road test and look at the specs page again.

Thanks @JMill67 for your comments, which made me get into the files and verify what I probably should have known about , but didn't.

Enjoy!
CBODY67

Those non Rallye 15X7's that came on B&E bodies are being reproduced by Tony D'Agostino

 

[fury fan]

Just looked at those last night, they are $1000 a set of 4.
Considering reproduction 15x7 standard wheels are $175 each, that's not a bad price.