78 Newport trans question

Cadee

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I have a 78 Newport with the 400-4 bbl converted to Chrysler electronic ignition and lean burn delete.
Entire new fuel/carb system and ignition system. Car runs fine at take off and at cruising speeds.
My issue is, when the car shifts into 3rd, it stumbles/shakes for about 3 seconds then runs smooth. Is this due to the lock up torque converter?
Thank you.
 
I have a 78 Newport with the 400-4 bbl converted to Chrysler electronic ignition and lean burn delete.
Entire new fuel/carb system and ignition system. Car runs fine at take off and at cruising speeds.
My issue is, when the car shifts into 3rd, it stumbles/shakes for about 3 seconds then runs smooth. Is this due to the lock up torque converter?
Thank you.

The described symptom does sound like lock-up torque converter shudder. With all else okay, adding Mopar friction modifier to the transmission fluid can reduce or eliminate the shudder.

Mopar part number 4318060, 4318060AB or 4318060AD, or other possible brands such as Motorcraft XL3:

Screenshot 2025-09-18 10.08.15 AM.png


Alternatively, switching the fluid to Mopar specification ATF+4 fluid can do the same, if your current fluid is due for a change.
 
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If you decrease the throttle just BEFORE the shift, or just after it happens, if it is the torque converter clutch causing the issue, the issue will markedly decrease. It will not disappear, just decrease in intensity.

On the other side of things, if you increase the throttle at the shift point, the intensity of the vibration/shudder will increase, too.

Now, in the earlier years of Chrysler using lock-up torque converters, the initial lock-up speeds was like 27mph or when the 2-3 shift happened. To me, when the shift happened so soon, that meant that all of the acceleration (unless there was enough throttle input to trigger a part-throttle downshift into 2nd gear, all of the acceleration was in locked-up third gear, which would be slower than expected with less engine sounds.

But I observed that Chrysler used more-early shift points anyway. Their orientation toward earlier shift points also tended to coincide with the way exhaust emissions were measured, as in "Grams/Mile" rather than the earlier "Parts Per Million". Which also coincided with fewer rear axle ratio choices compared to what could have happened in the earlier model years of the 1960s. AND those choices were usually more "highway friendly" in lower cruise rpms, too.

By the 1980 model year, the torque converter lock-up point had been raised to about 53mph, which tended to work better and be less-intrusive. When the lock-up happened, the bulk of any acceleration's need was minimized and the engine was producing more torque anyway. Just worked better. For ANY engine which was spec's for "HD Service", as in police vehicles and trailer tow optioned vehicles, no lock-up torque converter.

Changing the lock-up speed can require taking things apart, as the torque converter control is mechanical rather than electronic, internally. Not easy to do. Seems like there is a separate little valve body for the lock-up function? Taking it apart, a stiffer spring might be needed to delay lock-up?

When my '80 Newport started to shudder when the converter locked-up, I knew what it was and sought to minimize it with driving behavior modification. When it locked-up and started to shudder, I would back-out of the throttle enough so that there was NO or decreased torque load on the converter clutch. After locked-up, then I'd ease back into the throttle and continue onward. EVEN if I was on an incline and was trying to maintain speed! I knew what the eventual "fix" would be . . . a new lock-up torque converter. ATF was the recommended Dexron-type atf and had been changed, too.

ALL of the OEMs had shudder issues, mainly due to normal wear of the converter clutches. They also upgraded their recommended atf from what it had been, "friction-modified" as they termed it, to better tolerate the initial slippage of the converter clutch when it locked-up. For Chrysler, it was the ATF+ fluids, from the prior Dexron-style fluids with a friction-modifier additive, in about 1996, after the introduction of the LH cars.

In some respects, the better-spec atf might be considered a Band-Aid fix of sorts, BUT it can't hurt to try it anyway. It might "buy time" to save money for the eventual transmission removal and new converter repairs. IF it works well, so much the better. In the mean time, reducing the input torque to the converter when it locks-up needs to be tried, so minimize slippage and shuddering.

Just my experiences and observations,
CBODY67
 
First try advancing the timing and see if that changes.

Is this a lean burn? Is it still intact or swapped to a regular distributor? Does it have a working vacuum advance?

What is the vehicle speed when this happens?
What is the throttle position? Are you half throttle getting on the freeway of light throttle in town?

When it shifts RPM drops and the load on the engine increases.
 
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First try advancing the timing and see if that changes.

What is the vehicle speed when this happens?
What is the throttle position?
Thanks for the quick responses guys.
To answer 413's questions:
I have not checked the timing. but no pinging or dieseling.
Converted from lean burn
Chrysler electronic ignition
has vacuum advance
happens at LIGHT throttle in town only
 
What is the normal lock-up speed on light throttle?
 
What is the normal lock-up speed on light throttle?
What is the normal lock-up speed on light throttle?
Around 25 mph. If i give it a bit more throttle off the line, the shudder goes away. I think I'll just learn how to "drive through it". It's not highly annoying, but I will check the timing and see if that changes things.
Thank you everyone.
 
Of course, you made sure the transmission fluid is full, right? The lock up on these unique big block lockup torqueflites is very sensitive to low fluid.
 
Just because Chrysler set the lockup speed that LOW, does not mean that is the best speed for the 2-3 upshift, period.

Get a 1/8" wide black plastic wire tie and put it in the back of the slot on the transmission rod, in the 4:39 location (bottom and as far back as it will go). That will effectively put more pre-load on the transmission rod to raise the part throttle shift points a few mph. I did that on my '80 Newport 360 2bbl and it has caused NO problems with transmission longevity. I did similar on our '66 Newport 383 2bbl, with no issues (like in 1973!).

The converter will not lockup until after the 2-3 shift has happened.

The reason the shudder is happening is that the engine is trying to LUG the car along at, basically, hot base idle speed. Just like getting into high gear on a manual transmission too soon and the engine bucking in protest.

Just my experiences and observations,
CBODY67
 
The trans in my drag car came directly from a 78 Newport 400-4bbl....i still have the entire drivetrain. I built it to suit my needs, but it was original to the car, and was never a lockup unit. Are you 100% sure that yours is?? If need be, post up the trans # from the drivers side oil pan rail and we will decode it.
 
If you increase the line pressure, it will firm up your shifts nicely.
 
How is that done?
transgo reprogramming kit, level 2 (tow) for heavy car you will also get their tech line
good ideas above, start by adjusting kickdown, use atf plus 4 (change it TWICE unless your converter has a drain) adjust bands while pan off
 
transgo reprogramming kit, level 2 (tow) for heavy car you will also get their tech line
good ideas above, start by adjusting kickdown, use atf plus 4 (change it TWICE unless your converter has a drain) adjust bands while pan off
Ok thanks.
 
How is that done?
There's a spring loaded Allen head bolt on the valve body where you can make that adjustment. You really should have a good manual to explain the procedure though. There are measurements that should be taken at the same time.
 
The trans in my drag car came directly from a 78 Newport 400-4bbl....i still have the entire drivetrain. I built it to suit my needs, but it was original to the car, and was never a lockup unit. Are you 100% sure that yours is?? If need be, post up the trans # from the drivers side oil pan rail and we will decode it.
This is interesting and got me thinking. I nerd out about one year only options and the big block lock up 727 (400 cu in only) falls into this category.

When looking at the factory documentation the waters are muddy. The databook would have one think that every 400 Newport/ NY would have a lock up 727. However the engineering book says "most" engines would have the lock up.

I went looking at options and saw that the lock up was not in those cars equipped with A36 heavy duty pkge or high altitude. Probably the case for your driveline.

The lock up feature did not do well with big block torque and most have not survived. I pulled a 78 400 driveline and saw that the torque converter had a "lock up" sticker on it. Probably to differentiate them from the non lock ups that were destined to live behind the last of the 440s.

My 78 NY has the lock up 727 and it is unhappy when driving it hard. It likes leisurely acceleration for sure.
 
The lock-up converter was not part of ANY HO or HD service option, no matter the engine size. That means factory trailer tow option cars and factory HO-option engine cars (which would have had factory dual exhaust). And any 3/4 and above pickup trucks/vans (which would have a factory GVW of 8600lib and above). Lock-up was only in 3rd gear, too.

Lock-up speeds did vary with model year, getting higher in later model years than in the first model years. Which helped.

The KEY to minimize the shudder upon lock-up is to minimize throttle input when the 2-3 shift happens. For a second. Or to have all of the acceleration "done" at the 2-3 shift, so the load on the tc frictions will be reduced, too. Once shifted and locked-up, should be no issues, usually.

Enjoy!
CBODY67
 
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