traintech55
Senior Member
It will never happen.
California Governor signs order to ban gas vehicles by 2035
- Thread starter Yeahrightgreer
- Start date
California probably has the nicest climate in the nation for most folks, and certainly it is desirable for those on the steet not to have to worry about freezing in the winters. So we get a lot of homeless folks here and we also have plenty of missions that do their part to feed them and try their best to take care of them medically and there are also a lot homeless living quarters being built at great expense to the cities and the state overall. Many of these folks generally have mental health problems that have never been addressed and are in pretty poor condition and wouldn't live in a shelter if one was provided. It is a tough problem but I believe we are doing more to help them than most other states. Tell me what your state is doing for them that we haven't been trying to do.
As I tried to detail regarding California's efforts above in smog and climate change already successfully, what has anyone else done to solve these problems like we have that you would rely on more to get the job done?
mikedrini
Well-Known Member
I'm sorry, I can't help but see the humor in you being so adamant in regards to California "pioneering" emissions regulations for the betterment of all mankind on the one hand and driving your forward looking Chrysler on the other.
Portland became a sanctuary city for both the homeless and the undocumented population a couple of years ago. Now they have riots every night and you can hardly walk the sidewalks because there are piles of crap everywhere. Downtown store fronts are mostly boarded up and closed. We would be glad to send all of them to you for the blessings of liberalism/socialism/communism.
Dave
azblackhemi
Old Man with a Hat
Arizona is still a conservative state and we have a huge homeless problem as well. As Steve said it's the weather draws them to warm climates. We get a huge influx in the winter when everywhere else gets cold.
The Hemi engine in my 300C for example is very efficient and because we have been able to get new vehicles down to near zero emissions when running on gasoline now, such collector cars like I drive very seldom are exempt from smog check because the effects of the infrequency of folks with collector cars using them is relatively minor and doesn't contribute significantly to the smog problem or climate change issue. In our governor's Executive Order, old cars are not being banned from still being used. California tries to achieve balance that makes sense in all the rulemakings I have been aware of.
The faster climate change emissions are brought down, the focus on forcing older vehicles off the road entirely will be decreased, just like it was possible to exempt 1976 and older cars from Smog Check in this state. Think about it. Calfornia is one of the most attractive places in the world to live and most political folks here are aware of the need to preserve the desirability of living here. That is why so many wealthy folks choose to live here rather than anywhere else. Even Jay Leno has his collection out here. Things need to be balanced to preserve the CA lifestyle that includes collector vehicles with no regrets. It is part of who we are.................
1966newport
Well-Known Member
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i will be dead by 2035 or too old to care
Follow the money.
Man made climate change is a hoax and a BS religion for gullible nose pickers worldwide. Proven by the fact there has never once been a public debate on the subject and any one that simply disagrees is labeled a "denier" of science and outcast from any liberal group or college. No other field of science uses peer pressure to destroy the lives and careers of those that may disagree. This is an enormous red flag. Do they apply an evil name to, or destroy the career of Anthropologists that don't believe Lucy is the "missing link" between apes and man? Of course not! It's debated in open forum, which has never once happened with climate change because theres simply too much money at stake for everyone involved. Wake up and smell the coffee.
carrman
Senior Member
Thats OK, we don't need California.
California probably has the nicest climate in the nation for most folks, and certainly it is desirable for those on the steet not to have to worry about freezing in the winters. So we get a lot of homeless folks here and we also have plenty of missions that do their part to feed them and try their best to take care of them medically and there are also a lot homeless living quarters being built at great expense to the cities and the state overall. Many of these folks generally have mental health problems that have never been addressed and are in pretty poor condition and wouldn't live in a shelter if one was provided. It is a tough problem but I believe we are doing more to help them than most other states.
this seems like the problem not the solution.
are you inferring that people travel to california to become homeless? i doubt it. i'm sure most are from california to begin with. maybe the high cost of living there has cost them their home? maybe the technology and science advancements that you praise, have put them out of work?
why are the taxpayers building living quarters for them? why make being homeless acceptable? why build shelters for homeless people with mental issues that refuse to live in shelters.
don't get me wrong, i'm all for helping people, but give them a hand up not a hand out. there is no incentive to work when you can get everything for free. the taxpayers pay for this, increasing taxes, increasing the cost of living, increasing homelessness. a vicious cycle.
The Goose
Senior Member
Before anybody tells me to shut up let me say I’ve helped put up hundreds of the giant whirlybirds and thousands of miles of solar.
It’s all a giant scam. They provide power but not enough to replace what they cost. The waste fraud and corruption is not to be believed. Also everyone overlooked that the head of CARB (always sounds like a Bond villain) is a fraud caught with fake credentials and yet when caught nothing happened to this scumbag. She’s still running the show last that I heard. These religious zealots are so crazy they told us (Caterpillar) that our large back up power generators weren’t clean enough and we needed to completely redesign them. CAT grew a pair gave California the high sign and now no longer sells the big generator engine plants in the state. These are for the Hospitals LoL!!! The crazy part is that most of these “green” elite clowns have power generation plants or for the smaller potentates back up generators on there property so when the grid fails the continue to sip wine and cheese in air conditioned comfort. Do as I say not as I do. Believe me or don’t I couldn’t care less but that’s the truth from the front line trenches and sometimes the truth hurts.
It’s all a giant scam. They provide power but not enough to replace what they cost. The waste fraud and corruption is not to be believed. Also everyone overlooked that the head of CARB (always sounds like a Bond villain) is a fraud caught with fake credentials and yet when caught nothing happened to this scumbag. She’s still running the show last that I heard. These religious zealots are so crazy they told us (Caterpillar) that our large back up power generators weren’t clean enough and we needed to completely redesign them. CAT grew a pair gave California the high sign and now no longer sells the big generator engine plants in the state. These are for the Hospitals LoL!!! The crazy part is that most of these “green” elite clowns have power generation plants or for the smaller potentates back up generators on there property so when the grid fails the continue to sip wine and cheese in air conditioned comfort. Do as I say not as I do. Believe me or don’t I couldn’t care less but that’s the truth from the front line trenches and sometimes the truth hurts.
California probably has the nicest climate in the nation for most folks, and certainly it is desirable for those on the steet not to have to worry about freezing in the winters. So we get a lot of homeless folks here and we also have plenty of missions that do their part to feed them and try their best to take care of them medically and there are also a lot homeless living quarters being built at great expense to the cities and the state overall. Many of these folks generally have mental health problems that have never been addressed and are in pretty poor condition and wouldn't live in a shelter if one was provided. It is a tough problem but I believe we are doing more to help them than most other states.
this seems like the problem not the solution.
are you inferring that people travel to california to become homeless? i doubt it. i'm sure most are from california to begin with. maybe the high cost of living there has cost them their home? maybe the technology and science advancements that you praise, have put them out of work?
why are the taxpayers building living quarters for them? why make being homeless acceptable? why build shelters for homeless people with mental issues that refuse to live in shelters.
don't get me wrong, i'm all for helping people, but give them a hand up not a hand out. there is no incentive to work when you can get everything for free. the taxpayers pay for this, increasing taxes, increasing the cost of living, increasing homelessness. a vicious cycle.
You clearly haven't dealt with homeless people have you?
They have mental health issues predominantly - how would you propose to give them a hand up?
Folks that can't afford to live here generally move to other states - they just do not go from living in a home or apartment and then onto the street if they lose their job or find they can't make ends meet.
This state creates new jobs and provides plenty of good paying jobs, but one also has to generally have a good education to get those jobs.
Trying to provide shelter has been mostly an experiment in the city of Los Angeles in an effort to see whether providing them with a place to stay and give them help in getting out of being homeless at the same time through related medical and special help programs to get them functioning again. But many of these folks are too far gone and most folks here don't want to see them suffer needlessly. Mental health is a really big issue in this country but it doesn't get the attention it needs. What do you do in New York with these folks?
Also, to say I am inferring .................isn't correct, as you should be saying I am "implying" for your sentence to make sense.
California needs to gather up all the libtards and merge with Mexico new state could be called Mexifornica. It would be a perfect match, Liberals with no common sense and masses with little or no education, what could go wrong.
Dave
Dave
You obviously do not know what you are talking about. I know Mary Nichols and and her background and you don't obviously. You put up the equipment, so what do you really know about the cost and other issues you claim to know so much about? This is all B.S. You have often stated you hate this state and it shows. Why not move somewhere else and get a good job then? I asked you this before and you don't answer that question. Caterpillar isn't the only provider of backup generators for hospitals and many hospitals use equipment that complies with CA standards.
And no one said that at this point in time all of this equipment is yet where it needs to be in terms of development but we have to start somewhere.
After our President's great tax cut in 2016 that will cost this country $1.7 trillion, and more than 80% of the benefits will go to the richest folks in the country like himself and corporations that are doing fine in the stock market, you will need funding to keep what semblance of a budget going at all at the federal level and the stimulus package was expensive too since we haven't controlled the virus well at all and still more is needed............
you might just need California for the taxes it contributes to the federal budget. California is the highest contributor of any state and almost double the second highest, New York.
Maybe you just need more fires in Oregon to figure anything out yet??
Federal Taxes Paid by State
RANK STATE FEDERAL TAXES PAID (in thousands)
1 California $234,499,671
2 New York $140,510,002
3 Texas $133,417,081
my apologies on the inferring, implying mistake. it's been a long day.
it's a shame that many folks can't afford to live in california and are forced to move out of state. depending on their situation and lack of means to move, i'm sure some have become homeless. the same is happening in new york. the cost of living is outrageous.
it sounds like education is the key. maybe instead of a free lunch and place to stay, give it to them in exchange for an hour of classes a day. perhaps a trade school. prisoners with no hope of seeing the outside world are taught a trade, why not the homeless?
help them get the documentation needed to get a job. send them out to pick up trash or fill pot holes for a couple of bucks. earned money means more than a handout. someone has to supervise them which would create more jobs where a high level of education isn't needed.
if the state is already trying to help the mentally challenged then continue to do so but teach them also. the local arc here sends as many of their residents as possible out into the workforce. they keep some of the money and the home keeps the rest to offset costs.
how do we know that many of the people with mental health issue are suffering? maybe in some cases it is just our perception that they are suffering. they might be fine (or at least able to cope) with their situation. i'm not a believer in "drugging up" people just because they don't fit in a mold. just because they are different doesn't make them wrong. if they are able to survive on their own (with or without assistance) and aren't a menace to society, they are capable of learning or being trained just like anyone else.
carrman
Senior Member
The worst thing to happen to Oregon is the Californicators that moved here. California is rapidly becoming a third world hell hole, spoiling all it comes in contact with. The state needs cleaned off with well placed thermonuclear strikes and started over with again.
Yeahrightgreer
Senior Member
It’s boggles my mind that it’s the year 2020, and there are people who still do not believe man-made climate change is real...
John Tyndall first noted the possibility for global warming from human made greenhouse gases in 1859. 161 years ago. This ain’t anything new. You weren’t even alive then. Neither was your father. Maybe your grandfather was if you’re 90 years old.
It’s 2020, not 1654 where you couldn't readily go out and disprove theories and hypothesis’. You could literally go outside in your backyard, study and run your own tests if you wanted to disprove climate change. If it’s a hoax why don’t you? If you did you would be disproving possibly one of the greatest “conspiracies” in human history.
John Tyndall first noted the possibility for global warming from human made greenhouse gases in 1859. 161 years ago. This ain’t anything new. You weren’t even alive then. Neither was your father. Maybe your grandfather was if you’re 90 years old.
It’s 2020, not 1654 where you couldn't readily go out and disprove theories and hypothesis’. You could literally go outside in your backyard, study and run your own tests if you wanted to disprove climate change. If it’s a hoax why don’t you? If you did you would be disproving possibly one of the greatest “conspiracies” in human history.
Gov. Newsom's exec order is probably more formality than anything else. OEMs in the USA, Europe, and in other areas are moving toward elec or hybrid elec vehicles faster than most might be aware. A few years ago, Volvo stated that all of their new platforms would be elec or hyvbrid. Since then, the momentum toward that change in Europe has intensified. Many of the larger cities in Europe have already limited access of older vehicles into their city core areas. A few years ago, the air quality in the Alps was pretty bad, blamed on poor air flow, the burning of wood for residential heat, and diesel truck emissions. Look at how many electrified BMWs are now available in the USA. The move toward electric vehicles has already started. Notice the GM announcements of a few weeks ago where they will become very involved in building electric trucks? The new GMC Hummer next year? Anybody see that Ford Mustang Mach-E wheelstanding at the drag strip?
Long haul trucks? I suspect that they will become further multi-propulsional. Electric for the city areas, then diesel/CNG or full CNG for the long hauls. There is an expanding CNG fueling network already happening, which started about 10 years ago. There are a few websites which list the CNG fueling stations as there is one for the electric charging stations.
Electric grid issues? Back in the 1980s, I was at the Dallas (TX) new car show and Texas Electric had had some Chevy S-10s converted to full electric power. We chatted with the rep and he stated that the charging was not an issue. The driver would plug the vehicle in when they got home. Then, "the grid" would be controlled to cycle across the area, sequentially, to charge the vehicles. He seemed to consider it "no big deal". When the customer got ready to go to work the next morning, the vehicle would be fully charged and ready to go. Only thing might be that many metro areas are now "24 hour" places, moreso now than back then. Still, with some extra lines added to the poles, the "recharging grid" could exist and be controlled as he mentioned. Infrastructure expansion rather than something completely new, in many cases.
Also, don't forget about residential geo-thermal energy to decrease electrical/natural gas fuel needs for heating and cooling. A recent segment on "This Old House" showed how far this type of residential hvac and hot water generation had come, especially the installation part.
Regardless of how much alleged fraud might be in the wind generation industry, the number of windmills across the plains of TX and the Arbuckle Mountains in southern Oklahoma is surprising. As is the number of residental roofs covered in solar panels. Tesla even makes residential battery set-ups, too.
Almost all new electric power plants being built will use natural gas as fuel. It's "cleaner burning" than coal. Those utilities are planning FAR into the future, regardless of what happens in the White House. As are the vehicle manufacturers, too. Everybody knows how much money the collector car hobby contributes to the national economy, too.
Look at how the number of electric lawn equipment has grown in the past 5 years or so. A new electric zero-turn mower is $4100.00 or so, about $1K more than a similar gas model. A 19" 40V push mower is on sale at Lowes for $199.00, as a 20" gas model is $176.00. Each has their own place in the grand scheme of things. Just as electric vehicles vs gasoline or diesel vehicles to. NEITHER is going out of production anytime soon, either. Yet how soon the switch to electric happens (in the new market) will depend upon market acceptance rather than what politicians feel like.
To each their own . . .
CBODY67
Long haul trucks? I suspect that they will become further multi-propulsional. Electric for the city areas, then diesel/CNG or full CNG for the long hauls. There is an expanding CNG fueling network already happening, which started about 10 years ago. There are a few websites which list the CNG fueling stations as there is one for the electric charging stations.
Electric grid issues? Back in the 1980s, I was at the Dallas (TX) new car show and Texas Electric had had some Chevy S-10s converted to full electric power. We chatted with the rep and he stated that the charging was not an issue. The driver would plug the vehicle in when they got home. Then, "the grid" would be controlled to cycle across the area, sequentially, to charge the vehicles. He seemed to consider it "no big deal". When the customer got ready to go to work the next morning, the vehicle would be fully charged and ready to go. Only thing might be that many metro areas are now "24 hour" places, moreso now than back then. Still, with some extra lines added to the poles, the "recharging grid" could exist and be controlled as he mentioned. Infrastructure expansion rather than something completely new, in many cases.
Also, don't forget about residential geo-thermal energy to decrease electrical/natural gas fuel needs for heating and cooling. A recent segment on "This Old House" showed how far this type of residential hvac and hot water generation had come, especially the installation part.
Regardless of how much alleged fraud might be in the wind generation industry, the number of windmills across the plains of TX and the Arbuckle Mountains in southern Oklahoma is surprising. As is the number of residental roofs covered in solar panels. Tesla even makes residential battery set-ups, too.
Almost all new electric power plants being built will use natural gas as fuel. It's "cleaner burning" than coal. Those utilities are planning FAR into the future, regardless of what happens in the White House. As are the vehicle manufacturers, too. Everybody knows how much money the collector car hobby contributes to the national economy, too.
Look at how the number of electric lawn equipment has grown in the past 5 years or so. A new electric zero-turn mower is $4100.00 or so, about $1K more than a similar gas model. A 19" 40V push mower is on sale at Lowes for $199.00, as a 20" gas model is $176.00. Each has their own place in the grand scheme of things. Just as electric vehicles vs gasoline or diesel vehicles to. NEITHER is going out of production anytime soon, either. Yet how soon the switch to electric happens (in the new market) will depend upon market acceptance rather than what politicians feel like.
To each their own . . .
CBODY67
Thanks for your thoughtful comments. I was in charge of a ministry for homeless younger people when I was in my late 20s and it was a real challenge. Every single case was very different and we did our best to make each one of them whole. We required them to attend our Bible studies and required them to go out and look for work in order to stay in the housing we set up for them. Maybe 20% of them were able to get out of their difficulties and the rest of them just didn't seem to have the will or capability to function much at all. It opened my eyes to the real challenges of trying to help these individuals most of whom had mental attitudes, alcohol addiction and thought processess that were impossible to penetrate. One thing we did provide and that subsidized housing in general provides for a temporary time period at least is an address showing where they lived that was vital on their job applications. The ministry I was involved in was supported by a local church and we had a number of board members working with us to provide the folks in the home with the support and discipline needed for them to function in the real world. We had one home for the men and another for the women. The home for the women was even more of a challenge than one could possibly imagine unless you were involved in it first hand.
I do agree with you that not all these homeless folks are as miserable as they might seem or appear and seem to function reasonably well in the environment they are in. But alcoholism is a difficult challenge that many of these folks can not over come .
Thanks again for you thoughts, as they are helpful.
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