Fuselage Fury HP engines

[polara71]

That's the crux of it right there.

Where would the HP be stamped on a 383? Pan rail?

Kevin

Just because the 330 horse version had 40 horses more than the 290 version does that make it a high performance engine ?
Does the existence of a 335 horse engine mean that the 330 horse engine isn't a HP engine?
Can both be considered HP engines? If so what is the deciding factor?

 

[polara71]

The machined pad next to the distributor.

 

[twostick]

Just because the 330 horse version had 40 horses more than the 290 version does that make it a high performance engine ?
Does the existence of a 335 horse engine mean that the 330 horse engine isn't a HP engine?
Can both be considered HP engines? If so what is the deciding factor?

According to the brochure (or was it service manual quote) posted above, yes the 330 horse engine was high performance.

375 horse 440 Magnum is high performance, so is a 390 horse 6pak engine. Pretty sure ALL 6pak engines are stamped HP. I'm not sure about whether ALL 375 horse engines are stamped HP but I have seen some 350 Horse 440's stamped HP and nobody considers the 350 engine high performance.

Kevin

 

[polara71]

No, they aren't considered by any reasonable person a HP engine.

My N code isn't stamped HP, it is not considered as such. It is just a different variant of the 383 mill.

 

[Factorial]

I still don’t know what SMH stands for.

SMH is a popular online acronym that teens and young adults love to type into their social media posts or in text messages to express the same physical body language of shaking their head in disappointment, disagreement and/or disbelief.

In short, shake my head. I initially thought it was "smack my head."

 

[69CoronetRT]

According to the brochure (or was it service manual quote) posted above, yes the 330 horse engine was high performance.

375 horse 440 Magnum is high performance, so is a 390 horse 6pak engine. Pretty sure ALL 6pak engines are stamped HP. I'm not sure about whether ALL 375 horse engines are stamped HP but I have seen some 350 Horse 440's stamped HP and nobody considers the 350 engine high performance.

Kevin

Why would a 350 horse assembly be stamped HP when the purpose of the HP stamp was to designate the assembly has the high performance cam ergo 375 horse.

 

[twostick]

Why would a 350 horse assembly be stamped HP when the purpose of the HP stamp was to designate the assembly has the high performance cam ergo 375 horse.

Because it was in a Town and Country wagon with a towing package and the shortblock got a windage tray and the big rods along with the heavy duty cooling pkg. As I recall it had a roller timing set too.

An engineer's definition of high performance encompasses more than just drag racing. It was a truck motor basically so it has to live more than 10 seconds. Yes that's an exaggeration. However running 8mpg or more of fuel through a 440 wagon for hours on end pulling the family Airstream across country takes a toll on parts so you build it with the best stuff you have, hence the HP stuff. It's more than just a camshaft.

Kevin

 

['69FuryIIIConvertible]

Stop it.! If you are going to carry the torch then this stuff matters. If you're gonna not care then you wouldn't have asked the question.

Clearly I'm not going to carry the torch. That is why I am decidedly hoarding Plymouth C bodies and resurrecting the worst examples of them.

What I refuse to understand is the fact that This is 5 pages of repeated information at this point.

For what difference? A bump stick and a Stamping.....

You answered my question in all of 2 seconds and less then a paragraph...

No, they aren't considered by any reasonable person a HP engine.

My N code isn't stamped HP, it is not considered as such. It is just a different variant of the 383 mill.

Thats an N code though....the car in question has the H code 383....

Nick

 

[69CoronetRT]

Because it was in a Town and Country wagon with a towing package and the shortblock got a windage tray and the big rods along with the heavy duty cooling pkg. As I recall it had a roller timing set too.

An engineer's definition of high performance encompasses more than just drag racing. It was a truck motor basically so it has to live more than 10 seconds. Yes that's an exaggeration. However running 8mpg or more of fuel through a 440 wagon for hours on end pulling the family Airstream across country takes a toll on parts so you build it with the best stuff you have, hence the HP stuff. It's more than just a camshaft.

Kevin

.??

What year are you talking about?

 

[twostick]

.??

What year are you talking about?

It was a 69.

Kevin

 

[kmccabe56]

You seem to be implying that the Super Commando 383-4 was not considered a HP engine. I disagree, although the RR 383-4 was rated at 335, IMO that doesn't mean the Super Commando 383-4 used in Fury's was not considered a HP engine also. From a technical perspective, the 330 Bhp engine had higher Bhp, higher torque, dual exhaust, and required Premium fuel compared to the 383-2 290 Bhp. From a Marketing perspective, Plymouth called there HP engines "Super Commando" and used the red lettered hood ornament on the 383-4 330 Bhp engines so they obviously considered it HP.

View attachment 303074

That 5hp difference could all be attributed to differences in the exhaust systems between "B" and "C" body cars.

 

[70_NPORT]

In short, shake my head. I initially thought it was "smack my head."

a kind of short hand used when txt'ing back and forth with other people......typically on a smartphone. NWs.

 

[69CoronetRT]

That 5hp difference could all be attributed to differences in the exhaust systems between "B" and "C" body cars.

The 335 horse B/E body assembly had the higher performance cam, valve train, and, depending on application, associated distributor, carb and air cleaner.

The exhaust system only affected the rating on the A body application.

 

[Tracy Martin]

Well I'm a believer some 1969 Furys did indeed hold 383 HP engines. Granted this may only be confirmed by pulling the cam shaft. Here is my weathered unmolested 69. The alternator and air cleaner have been swiped off the car long ago while my friend/ previous owner had it setting out side for 20 years. A few years ago I acquired it and crawled underneath to verify the engine block has the matching serial number to match the VIN on the car. Also then clean off the distributor pad to find a HP stamp. This car has a factory Holley 4bbl carb. I'll don't currently have a photo of the HP stamp or engine on my phone but can take some if interested in more photos.

 

['69FuryIIIConvertible]

Sounds like definitive proof to me, it has the HP stamp...

 

[twostick]

Sounds like definitive proof to me, it has the HP stamp...

I've never seen a Holley on a 383 OEM. Is that a factory cop car?

I Googled up a tag decoder. E63 comes up as a 335hp 383...

Kevin

 

[Tracy Martin]

Yes. This is a real Nebraska Fury Pursuit car. Certified speedometer, unit number painted in door jam, reading / front mounted dome light, K-code indicates government car. My old watched it sell at auction from the state impound yard ages ago. He kept track of it and eventually bought it. The car sat in his pasture of 300 plus Plymouths for decades. He was a collector but didn't realize how rare this car may be today. A few parts were stolen off and eventually the disc brakes and HP engine would have been pulled. I was fortunate enough to purchase it and stuff it inside. I'll take more pics of the carb and engine. I've had it buried for some time so I need to breif my memory too. Thanks-you.

 

['69FuryIIIConvertible]

I've never seen a Holley on a 383 OEM. Is that a factory cop car?

I Googled up a tag decoder. E63 comes up as a 335hp 383...

Kevin

Has a PK21 vin, so yes it's package.

PH23 km looking at also has the H code E63...

 

[69CoronetRT]

I've never seen a Holley on a 383 OEM. Is that a factory cop car?

I Googled up a tag decoder. E63 comes up as a 335hp 383...

Kevin

There is no 383-335 horse application that has a Holley in '68 or '69. An AVS was used in both years. So if it has a Holley it is a 383-4 with the standard cam and rated at 330 horse.

(1970 gets really funky with the numerous emissions, shaker hood and A/C combinations and deserves its own discussion. 1968 and 1969 A body 383-4 probably deserves its own discussion too)

There is no 383-335 horse application with A/C in '68 and '69 so if any car has A/C it has the 330 horse and the standard cam assembly.

There is no 383-4 335 horse three speed application in 68 and 69. There is in 1970.

Meaning...if you are looking for a 68 or 69 C body with the 335 horse assembly and associated HP stamp on the pad, you will need to start with a non A/C automatic that has an AVS. The VIN on the block will match the VIN on the dash. Following the ‘69 B body applications, it will, likely, be orange. The broadcast sheet will indicate the car came with an AVS and not a Holley.

As shown earlier in the thread, the 1968-1970 E62/E63 code and H/N VIN code simply means the car has a 383-4. It doesn’t tell you the horsepower rating or application as many sources, incorrectly, list. These incorrect sources add to, and continue, the confusion as to what actual assemblies were used in what applications. They do not clarify anything. They treat the A, B and C body assemblies in each year as if they were the same assembly in all applications over three years and they are most certainly not the same assembly.

The sources do not account for the various horsepower ratings of the 383-4 in the A, B, or C bodies from 68-70.

1968 is different from 1969 and both are different from 1970 so you have to limit your discussion to applications in any one year.

You have to document which assembly came in which body via broadcast sheets or Lynch Road fender tags. Only then, can you know which assembly came in which application.

So, again, more broadcast sheets from C bodies = better documentation meaning better actual research and less reliance on incorrect third party sources. Save broadcast sheets, save tags, save window stickers.

 

[69CoronetRT]

Mopar didn't do anything different with 'cop car' assemblies. They are the same as any other assembly.

"Police car" 440s and "civilian" 440's used the same engine assembly. I would presume 383s are the same. This will be easy to document via the broadcast sheet.

One is a DM. One is a DK. Both are L codes. Both have the same 919 engine assembly code. Same transmission PN.