HP 69 383 or not?

themam2000k

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Hi there,

I am trying to figure out if I have a HP motor or not. The VIN has the H code but from what I’ve read that just means 383 4 barrel. The VIN also decodes to the 727 HD trans with low geared posi in the rear end. The block does not have the HD stamp unless it’s under the edge of the heads.

Without pulling the oil pan and looking for a windage tray I thought I’d run a scope into the valve cover and look at the valve springs to see if they have the double springs. Attached are a few pics of my mystery and wanted to see if anyone can identify if the valve springs are the double spring performance springs.

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What year is this vehicle? You would appear to have a "Magnum" 330 horse 383. The 335 horse engine should have the HP stamp on the block boss by the left of the distributor. The 335 horse engine was mostly used in super bees and roadrunners. The 335 horse engine had a double roller timing chain which you could see by removing the distributor and looking into its recess toward the timing cover. I would not expect a 383 335 horse in a standard C-Body.

Dave
 
Hi there, it’s in a 69 Newport Custom. I’ve been trying to figure it out myself but it’s time for the professionals now lol. I’ll pull the distributor and look for sure.
 
C-body 330 horse 383-4bbl is not an "HP" engine.

There is no VIN letter to differentiate between the 330 & 335 hp 383s, both are still "H" code in '67-'69 & "N" code in '70-'71.
 
Those are standard valve springs. Did they ever put an HP engine in a 69 C body? I doubt it. I had a 1968 H code 383 from a c body, no HP on block and didn't perform like one either.
 
Sometimes, many can (including ME) read too much into the "HP" designation!

With regards to my '70 Monaco Brougham 383 4bbl (engine code "N"), the sales literature and factory service manual notes "High Performance". It has the upswept exhaust manifolds, factory dual exhaust, and crinkle paint dual snorkel air cleaner. All the cosmetic trappings of a 383 "HP" motor. The upswept manifolds came to be normal issue for 4bbl 383s when the power ratings increased to 330 from 325, in the late 1960s. The factory dual exhaust had the same size pipes as the 440/375 motors, too. By that time, ALL B/RB motors had 1.74" exhaust valves, so prior HP items were quietly introduced into normal production.

NOW, the plot thickens in the case of E-body cars! In them, in 1970, a Code "N" engine was listed as both a 383/330 in non R/T Challengers AND 383/335 in Challenger R/Ts. THEN in one of the Dealer Order Guides, in the engine section, in a Dodge guide . . . there is a note with the 383/335 (in B-bodies) that if a Super Bee is ordered/built with factory a/c, the 383/330 will be substituted. This INCLUDES the Super Bee models, it states.

I believe the factory a/c cars were supposed to be painted "blue/turquoise" and the non-factory a/c cars were painted orange? My neighbor ordered a '68 Satellite with the "383 HP" 383/330 in it for high school graduation. HP exh manifolds. Open element "Road Runner" air cleaner, too. With factory a/c, so the engine was "blue/turquoise". Later, he drag raced the car. It ran very well!

So, looking at cam specs and such, it appears that "WE got played" in many respects! WE normally suspected that any "383 HP" would be the Road Runner non-factory a/c motor, rather than just a normal 383 4bbl 383/325 motor. (with the 256/260 cam in it). FWIW, my '70 Monaco DH43N will run 20-100 in just under 4/10 mile with 3.23 gears and P225/75-15 tires. Open the throttle at 50mph and it eagerly sends the speedo needle toward "triple digits" without thinking. Oh yeah, it has the Carter AVS carb on it, too.

The HD valve springs will NOT make power, just more durability at higher rpms as time progresses. To support WOT power for extended periods of time, as with a law enforcement vehicle chasing somebody. The double-roller timing chain is more durable and lasts longer than a normal chain, too. The windage tray can be a toss-up.

In some years of Plymouth Fury police cars, like 1969(?), the 440/350 was the top engine, not the 440/375. Why was that?

To fully assess the "HP" notation, one has to consider against what it is compared to! With the main issues being "4bbl and dual exhaust", at the very least.

END RESULT . . . use ONLY the VIN code to determine what came in the car, period. Then look at the VIN decoders for a C-body to go from there. THAT might not give you the "bragging rights" you might desire, but it is at least accurate for what the car came with.

Tune and tweak to get the engine running as good as it can and BE HAPPY with the results. It still IS a Chrysler 383 4bbl V-8 (and all that means).

Oh, all 383 4bbl in 1970 had the 10.75" torque converter, rather than the normal "2bb;" 11.75" converter. Which means it takes about 1-2 quarts less atf to fill it on a fluid/filter change. On my '70 DH43N. A bit higher stall speed? Yep.

Enjoy!
CBODY67
 
Hi there,

I am trying to figure out if I have a HP motor or not. The VIN has the H code but from what I’ve read that just means 383 4 barrel. The VIN also decodes to the 727 HD trans with low geared posi in the rear end. The block does not have the HD stamp unless it’s under the edge of the heads.

Without pulling the oil pan and looking for a windage tray I thought I’d run a scope into the valve cover and look at the valve springs to see if they have the double springs. Attached are a few pics of my mystery and wanted to see if anyone can identify if the valve springs are the double spring performance springs.

View attachment 732438
View attachment 732439
View attachment 732440
View attachment 732442

View attachment 732441

This looks like the one you have.

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The 68-70 383-4bbl HP assembly with higher lift cam et al was only available in:

68-69 A bodies
68-70 B bodies
70 E bodies.

There is no 68-70 C body 383-4bb HP assembly. All of the C body 383-4bbl cars are standard cam assemblies rated at 330 horse.

The actual applications and installation of the HP assembly varies by year. Which application received the HP assembly in 68 may or may not be the same in 69 and both years can be different than 1970.

One could not simply “order” an HP assembly. The factory determined what assembly came in the car based on the application. You got the HP assembly in a 68 Road Runner without a/c. You couldn’t order the assembly in a Satellite.

Typical considerations as to whether the car came with the HP assembly include the transmission and a/c and in some years the model.

There is no 335 horse B body a/c assembly in 68 or 68 but there is for MY 1970.

Considerations for 1970 applications include N95, N96, transmission and a/c meaning the E body non ‘Cuda a Challenger installs do vary quite a bit.

1968-1970 VIN codes H and N and sales codes 62/63 only tell us the car got a 383-4. They do not tell us which 383-4 assembly the car received. For that, we have to look at other factors.

There are 2bbl and 4bbl exhaust manifolds. There are no manifolds specific to the HP assembly.

Not all 68-70 383-4bbls are HP assemblies meaning you can’t tell an HP assembly simply by looking at exhaust manifolds. You have to consider other factors.
 
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Howdy all
Well ok I had to check my 1970 Newport 383 and no HP on pad, it has all the trimmings of an HP. Here is a thought would the carburetor be different on HP vs non HP 383's.
 
Howdy all
Well ok I had to check my 1970 Newport 383 and no HP on pad, it has all the trimmings of an HP. Here is a thought would the carburetor be different on HP vs non HP 383's.
Don't quote me but I think the std. engine had a Carter and the HP's had a Holley.
 
Now . . . why was the 440/375 cam too wild for a 383 with factory a/c? Did it lose too much low-end torque for the shorter-stroke 383 compared to the longer-stroke 440, in the heavier C-body cars?

Was Chrysler too worried about longevity of the a/c compressor on an engine that might see over 5000rpm? But not on the prior 383 4bbl motors of pre-1966? Which were 383/330 without the upswept exh manifolds, generally smaller Carter AFBs, and the 1.60" exh valves.

I can understand a 4-spd factory a/c car not getting the 268/284 cam (as the possibility of higher rpms would certainly exist if a WOT shift was missed), but what might the "engineering reason" be for restricted use of that cam?

Did these same issues exist for the 400HO engines, too?

Seems like there were some unusual issues with the 1970 Chargers and 4-spds?

Just curious,
CBODY67
 
HP cars have 4bbl manifolds. Not all cars with 4bbl manifolds are HP.

68-70 C body 383-4bbl have 4bbl manifolds. That does not make them HP assemblies.
This only applys to 383s of the time frame to clear things up. Because T-code 350hp 440s would have "2bbl manifolds" and we all know 440s only had 4bbls..
 
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