Scenicruisin'..?

[amazinblue82]

Yeah, still horsing around with my buses. Something has come up and any of your folks with views/references, please advise. I little refresher five minute vid. here.



Both my '55 4501 and '68 GMC 4903 parlor diesels buses are 10-lug, stud-pilot wheels. I have collected 16 aluminum (even the inside rears) wheels over the years for use when the time came. I was told by someone early on, that to go with ALcoa's/or "Budd" stud-pilot wheels, I should replace ALL the studs.

This is because, so I am told, the aluminum wheels are a bit thicker than the steelies. bigger deal in back since they are duellies (8 wheels on two tandem, drive axles) and the factory studs are a little TOO short, resulting in breakage/other issues UNLESS they are swapped out.

My Whisperer passed away three years ago. COVID had already bogged down my work anyway, but I never talked with him in detail about making the aluminum conversion.

Anyway, the time approaches, and wheels for stud-pilot applications bought, I am getting this stud replacement advice.

---

Anybody have any experience with stuch a thing. In a bus, great. on a HD truck? ever heard of such thing? chime in if you have views of this issue.

 

[300rag]

Yeah, still horsing around with my buses. Something has some up ane any of your folks with views/references, please advise. I little refresher five minute vid.



Both my '55 and '68 buses are 10-lug, stud-pilot wheels. I have collested 16 aluminum (even the inside rears) wheels over the years for use when the time came. I was told by someone, that to go with ALcoa's/of "Budd" stud-piliot wheels I should replace ALL the studs.

This is because, so I am told, the aluminum wheels are a bit thicker than the steelies. and the factory studs are a little TOO short, resulting in breakage/other issues UNLESS they are swapped out.

My whisper passed away three years ago. COVID had bogged down my work anyway, but I never talked with him in detail about making the aluminum conversion. Anyway, the time approaches, and wheels for stud-pilot applications bought, I am getting this stud replacement advice.

---

Anybody have any experience with stuch a thing. In a bus, great. on a HD truck? ever heard of such thing? chime in if you have views of this issue.

I just finished reading a thread about this on one of the motorcoach (with Freightliner chassis) groups on FB. The discussion was about replacing the inner steelies with aluminum. Consensus from those that did, or tried to, was that the original studs didn't have sufficient threads available and longer studs were the way to go. I don't recall the additional length that was recommended. But that was on FB, so...

 

[amazinblue82]

Thanks chief.

i was replacing the inner rears because another guy told me "galvanic interaction" between the steel and aluminum would be an issue. I argued these a three-season coaches, so no winter driving.

was told it didnt matter, but since since I bought many of these stud pilot wheels (old Budds mainly) second hand, planning to get my polisihing buddy to give them mirror finishes, so they were fairly cheap.

Was always planning to replace lugs. somebody said torque on bus lugs could be several HUNDRED lbs and no telling how much life in 70 year old lubs.

STaying with 22.5 in diameter tires (mainly cuz thats the wheel size OEM [and geared accordingly] on it). another set of guys was trying to talk me into 24.5. retrospect, he just wanted to sell me some times somebody stiff him on.

My current fleecers (unfair, but $150+/hour labor piles up fast -- at least to my pedetrian budget) wanted THOUSANDS per bus for new studs/nuts. ONE guy wanted me to switch to hub-pilot .. that friggin' job was equal to the national debt of Peru to do ... and I am already 20% over budget and only 70% done.

Anyway, this lug thing NEVER came up in my experience with these buses so, irrespective of cost, it was an unpleasant surprise.

Thanks for the FB headsup. I read everything, even if it turns out to be unreliable BS, I am prepared for almost any discussion.

I miss my Whisper

Thanks again.

 

[300rag]

Thanks chief.

... another guy told me galvanic interaction between the steel and aluminum would be an issue...

Apparently there are some kind of spacers? to put between the steel and aluminum wheels that address this problem.

 

[amazinblue82]

Apparently there are some kind of spacers? to put between the steel and aluminum wheels that address this problem.

I was told that .. and THAT would be the catalyst to get LONGER studs .. that plus thicker wheels tipped the balance into the UNsafe zone for the OE length studs.

and we are only talking mm here, not inches. put it outta my mind since used wheels were such a deal ... now its back as a floater in the punch bowl.

thoughts? @70bigblockdodge, @twostick .

hey, where's @cantflip?

 

[300rag]

You could build a custom trailer similar to this but with the profile of the scenicruiser to match the bus...

 

[Justin Plant]

I was told that .. and THAT would be the catalyst to get LONGER studs .. that plus thicker wheels tipped the balance into the UNsafe zone for the OE length studs.

and we are only talking mm here, not inches. put it outta my mind since used wheels were such a deal ... now its back as a floater in the punch bowl.

thoughts? @70bigblockdodge, @twostick .

hey, where's @cantflip?

There are spacers available, we have them at work. If I can remember I'll get you the part number. They aren't thick at all maybe 1/16 of an inch. As far as changing the inside wheel to aluminum, I doubt you'd notice any difference in anything. I will say that no one makes Stud Piloted aluminum wheels anymore. You may be sitting on some gold with what you've managed to collect. Euclid is slowly phasing out all that old stuff. We used to keep dozens of part numbers of different length studs in stock, but not any more. Euclid used to print an actual size stud and nut catalog. So you could compare one item to another. Go to a heavy duty supplier, find the oldest employee there. If he or she has been around a few years, they may have the numbers memorized.
Good luck!

 

[twostick]

Thanks chief.

i was replacing the inner rears because another guy told me "galvanic interaction" between the steel and aluminum would be an issue. I argued these a three-season coaches, so no winter driving.

was told it didnt matter, but since since I bought many of these stud pilot wheels (old Budds mainly) second hand, planning to get my polisihing buddy to give them mirror finishes, so they were fairly cheap.

Was always planning to replace lugs. somebody said torque on bus lugs could be several HUNDRED lbs and no telling how much life in 70 year old lubs.

STaying with 22.5 in diameter tires (mainly cuz thats the wheel size OEM [and geared accordingly] on it). another set of guys was trying to talk me into 24.5. retrospect, he just wanted to sell me some times somebody stiff him on.

My current fleecers (unfair, but $150+/hour labor piles up fast -- at least to my pedetrian budget) wanted THOUSANDS per bus for new studs/nuts. ONE guy wanted me to switch to hub-pilot .. that friggin' job was equal to the national debt of Peru to do ... and I am already 20% over budget and only 70% done.

Anyway, this lug thing NEVER came up in my experience with these buses so, irrespective of cost, it was an unpleasant surprise.

Thanks for the FB headsup. I read everything, even if it turns out to be unreliable BS, I am prepared for almost any discussion.

I miss my Whisper

Thanks again.

This is what you are looking for.

10 hole plastic spacer, about 1/16" thick.

Any good commercial tire shop will stock them for hub pilot wheels but may have to order them for stud pilot. Amazon might be a source also for easy button shopping.

10 Hole Truck Wheel Guard 10 Hole Truck Wheel Guard

Kevin

 

[twostick]

New stud pilot wheels are still available. Not cheap, but a Google search turns up multiple options, including Amazon.

Kevin

 

[Justin Plant]

Accuride PN 5901 for stud piloted wheel plastic spacer. We are a stocking dealer for Alcoa and Accuride. I have never had any luck finding Stud piloted Aluminum "still in production" wheels. To be fair, Alcoa's site is absolutely awful. But, hey if you can find them. Great!

 

[azblackhemi]

Bringing this thread back from the dead @amazinblue82 1968 GMC Buffalo

 

[amazinblue82]

My Buffalo (pd 4903) IS FINE. Its silver now. Waitin' on my new Alcoas and to replace all the original windows/polish the sides (both harder than you think).

i Have diverted attention to the Scenicruiser. Since my whisperer passed away in 2024, progress has been slow but we're still horsin' around. getting knoweledgable available help has been a challenge past 18 months.

As retrement looms(blessing and and a curse) all that will pick up i hope. i'm still about two years off the 2024 plan for buses and cars. I lost my marketing deal on scenicruiser till 2026/27. Its a cherry deal though if i can finish that coach as planned.

 

[SIPLOWGUY]

Since my whisperer passed away in 2024

Sorry to hear

 

[amazinblue82]

Sorry to hear

He never was the same (neither was I) post pandemic He was 81. Good ole fella. loved these old parlor diesels. mind like a bear trap. only guy willing to supervise crack repair on Scenicruiser. That issue nearly sunk the whole deal.

 

[SIPLOWGUY]

I recently watched a You Tube video on these. I was a Bus Maintainer for the NYC Transit Authority (now MTA) from March 1987 to July 1988. In my Depot we had the GM New Looks (Fishbowl) and RTS. Coming out of a new car dealer, and never working on anything "heavy duty", I HATED IT! I went to the NYPD because most of the fleet is cars. They wanted to put me in the Truck Shop because I had bus experience! I was lucky enough to stay on cars lol. However, I am NOW very intrigued by busses, same thing with Ramblers. The only Transit bus I really liked was the 77 and 79 Flxibles. I think that was a really neat looking bus!

 

[azblackhemi]

I worked for Phoenix Transit for over 20 years doing accident repairs. We had a bunch of Flxables when I first started. Along with RTS's and Mann Articulating buses.

 

[amazinblue82]

my guy worked herr from when it opened until it . closed its near the old greyhound terminal ( mid 70's til mid 80's) in down town detroit.


20+years ago i wanted this building but it was overbuilt for cars and overpriced for me then. they tore it dow two years ago. it was built in 1948 in the moderne architectural style.

https://www.loopnet.com/property/2300-w-fort-st-detroit-mi-48216/26163-100000567/

Michigan Greyhound Bus Stations | RoadsideArchitecture.com