Do you have a link to a reputable supplier plz? Thanks.
1971 Fury GT, Gold, Promo Car
- Thread starter 1970FuryConv
- Start date
Inline Tube & SS Tubes both offer good stuff.
1970FuryConv
Old Man with a Hat
I'm not doing anything until the subframe is done. I want to make sure I don't have to buy another, or worse, a parts car.
It was sandblasted this weekend, but a 2nd sandblast needs to be done.
They are planning to break off the welds for badly bent left side mount flange so it can be bent back into correct shape.
They are hoping to start welding Wednesday night
Views from below.
Trans mount still attached to keep the subframe square.
It was sandblasted this weekend, but a 2nd sandblast needs to be done.
They are planning to break off the welds for badly bent left side mount flange so it can be bent back into correct shape.
They are hoping to start welding Wednesday night
Views from below.
Trans mount still attached to keep the subframe square.
Looks like the old farmer drove it "Dukes of Hazard" style!!
It does look repairable to my amateur eyes though. Nothing crunchy! Keep us posted......
Samplingman
Old Man with a Hat
Why do you want to break the welds on this? It is probably easier to bend this back into shape in place. Any simple scissor jack and some heat from a map gas torch should walk this out completely.
1970FuryConv
Old Man with a Hat
Thant's a good point, Jim. I'll ask. Thanks!
fury fan
Senior Member
Perhaps you've already fixed this, but:
Clamp some flat-bar to the red area and start to hammer the lip down flat - this will make the whole area stiffer for the next step. (obviously you can't do that the whole way to the tip due to the bend) Use your judgment for where having the lip helps, vs fights you to straighten the whole thing - this depends on how much twist is in the green area.
Attach a 3/4" Pony pipe clamp at either of the blue lines (simply depends on how it'll fit in there) and clamp to somewhere up at the engine crossmember that is stronger than what you're pulling here. (I can't speak for other brands, but I've abused Ponys for years and they are extremely durable)
After you have some tension on it, give a few well-placed hammer hits. Be aware the pipe clamp may pop up when the metal moves. (ziptie or bungee it to that availabe hole?) Assess, re-tighten the clamp, hit it again.
Cantilevered metal like this wants to absorb the hammer's energy via vibration, so the tension of the pipe clamp helps with that.
But the pipe clamp alone likely will not provide enough pull, so needs the hammer.
Intentional, well-placed hits will be your friend.
Then finish reworking the lip when it's all moved straight.
Clamp some flat-bar to the red area and start to hammer the lip down flat - this will make the whole area stiffer for the next step. (obviously you can't do that the whole way to the tip due to the bend) Use your judgment for where having the lip helps, vs fights you to straighten the whole thing - this depends on how much twist is in the green area.
Attach a 3/4" Pony pipe clamp at either of the blue lines (simply depends on how it'll fit in there) and clamp to somewhere up at the engine crossmember that is stronger than what you're pulling here. (I can't speak for other brands, but I've abused Ponys for years and they are extremely durable)
After you have some tension on it, give a few well-placed hammer hits. Be aware the pipe clamp may pop up when the metal moves. (ziptie or bungee it to that availabe hole?) Assess, re-tighten the clamp, hit it again.
Cantilevered metal like this wants to absorb the hammer's energy via vibration, so the tension of the pipe clamp helps with that.
But the pipe clamp alone likely will not provide enough pull, so needs the hammer.
Intentional, well-placed hits will be your friend.
Then finish reworking the lip when it's all moved straight.
'66 Fury I
Active Member
I have found a large pipe wrench to be helpful in situations like this. My old 3 foot has won it's share of battles! Lindsay
68PK21 440.6bbl
Old Man with a Hat
Why beat yourself up (or the frame) trying to bend it cold... heat is your friend, believe me that was the downfall of my 2nd 1968 PK21, when I straightened the RF stub horn I did it without heat, the whole major part of the frame cracked a year later. When I bashed the LF of my 1968 Fury III I straightened the horn with heat, cherry red hot the whole horn area, a decade later when the car went to the boneyard, no cracks.
I hope you are going to measure the stub since you have it off the car (right?).
.
I hope you are going to measure the stub since you have it off the car (right?).
.
1970FuryConv
Old Man with a Hat
The stub frame is at a welder's shop under repair. They are going to use heat to bend the subframe mount.
How do you advise I measure it after I get it back?
How do you advise I measure it after I get it back?
'66 Fury I
Active Member
The FSM gives the needed dimensions and measuring points. Should be easy to follow. Lindsay
68PK21 440.6bbl
Old Man with a Hat
Gotta love it, plumber's tools, that's as bad as a mechanic that has a claw hammer in his Snap On box.
For anyone else doing something like this on your own (I did in my teens) rent yourself a Porto/Porta Power, or buy one for that matter, they ain't that expensive.
.
Samplingman
Old Man with a Hat
You don’t need fancy tools to do most metal work on these cars. I own a porta-power, but I also use a 3 foot pipe wrench, claw hammer and one of my favorites, a spud wrench.
Gotta love it, plumber's tools, that's as bad as a mechanic that has a claw hammer in his Snap On box.
View attachment 569637
For anyone else doing something like this on your own (I did in my teens) rent yourself a Porto/Porta Power, or buy one for that matter, they ain't that expensive.
View attachment 569638
.
1970FuryConv
Old Man with a Hat
Okay. The subframe repair almost turned into a problem, because the main welder for the shop passed away, so he never touched the subframe. His partner has a day job, so any projects in-house got very much delayed. My three-week job turned into a 3 month job. But to his credit, Ben Haticole did finish the job. There were quite a few cracks across the front area below the radiator support. The most concerning one was a crack in the left side strut rod mount. Ben and his new assistant repaired all of those and bent the front portion of the frame back into shape. I think the work they did was excellent. They did also used heat to bend back the main mounts that install on the floor pan under the dash. They cleaned up the frame with blaster and wire wheel. Finally they painted it with 3 coats of POR 15 gloss black. After all that work, Ben and his new assistant felt that the subframe was square. The original cost for the job was going to be $1000. The actual cost in hours was about $1500. Because of the huge delay in finishing the job we agreed on a final cost of $1200.
Front View, finished subframe. The mounts that extend outward from the transmission cross member are important, because although they are unused, they do provide alignment while installing subframe. Only the main mounts and the mounts at the very rear of the subframe have bushings and fasteners.
Rear view
Bushings, fasteners, spacers after I cleaned them. I painted the bolts, studs, nuts, and spacers. The fasteners, bushings, and spacers for the main mounts are the 4 in the front. I did get some replacement bushings from a parts car. I consider myself highly fortunate that the bushings for the main mounts and rear mounts ended up being in very good to excellent condition. I don't have a source for new bushings.
Subframe under the car
I used 70" x 22" piece of three-quarter inch plywood under the engine cradle and transmission cross member. Also it helped to have 2 assistants, one at each front corner, to keep the subframe steady while I lifted it on the hydraulic Jack.
Right side main mount below the floor under the dash.
Upper Bushing part number is visible below, if you can find them.
Front View, finished subframe. The mounts that extend outward from the transmission cross member are important, because although they are unused, they do provide alignment while installing subframe. Only the main mounts and the mounts at the very rear of the subframe have bushings and fasteners.
Rear view
Bushings, fasteners, spacers after I cleaned them. I painted the bolts, studs, nuts, and spacers. The fasteners, bushings, and spacers for the main mounts are the 4 in the front. I did get some replacement bushings from a parts car. I consider myself highly fortunate that the bushings for the main mounts and rear mounts ended up being in very good to excellent condition. I don't have a source for new bushings.
Subframe under the car
I used 70" x 22" piece of three-quarter inch plywood under the engine cradle and transmission cross member. Also it helped to have 2 assistants, one at each front corner, to keep the subframe steady while I lifted it on the hydraulic Jack.
Right side main mount below the floor under the dash.
Upper Bushing part number is visible below, if you can find them.
1970FuryConv
Old Man with a Hat
Right side rear mount. This was the only area where damage caused variance in the alignment side to side. Right side rear is 10/16 inch away from the pinch weld at the rear corner of the subframe. Undamaged left side rear was 13/16 inch away from the pinch weld at the rear corner of the subframe.
A big positive was that the main mounts which are forward of the rear frame mounts ended up being in the exact same position in distance from the pinch weld. Wheel Alignment depends a lot more on these mounts being right than on the rear mounts being right.
Left side main mount
left side rear mount
once I had the subframe reinstalled according to the procedural sequence and torque specs in the body portion of the factory shop manual, I took this picture of the damage to the bottom of the right side of the subframe.
The test, to see whether the damage was incidental, was whether the unused mounts at opposite ends of the transmission cross member lined up with the matching holes in the supports under the passenger compartment floor.
This is the right side bracket alignment for the end of the transmission Cross member
this is the left side alignment. Both are about as close to perfect as I could ask for in a 52-year-old car.
A big positive was that the main mounts which are forward of the rear frame mounts ended up being in the exact same position in distance from the pinch weld. Wheel Alignment depends a lot more on these mounts being right than on the rear mounts being right.
Left side main mount
left side rear mount
once I had the subframe reinstalled according to the procedural sequence and torque specs in the body portion of the factory shop manual, I took this picture of the damage to the bottom of the right side of the subframe.
The test, to see whether the damage was incidental, was whether the unused mounts at opposite ends of the transmission cross member lined up with the matching holes in the supports under the passenger compartment floor.
This is the right side bracket alignment for the end of the transmission Cross member
this is the left side alignment. Both are about as close to perfect as I could ask for in a 52-year-old car.
1970FuryConv
Old Man with a Hat
These are some pictures of how the front of the subframe lined up under the radiator support panel. Every measurement that I took comparing right side gap to left side gap between the subframe and the support panel was exactly the same. I thought this was amazing given the damage to the front of the subframe caused by the farmer towing the car by the thin cross member under the radiator support rather than by the thick cross member that is the engine cradle. Was it worth $1200? I think so.
The only place where I had some heat cracking in the bushings was at the subframe mounts for the radiator support panel. For now, I'm going to move on from that, but I might come back and replace those bushings, if I can find new ones. The 2 studs on which the bushings mount are not hard to remove.
Subframe at radiator support panel
right side radiator support mount, the left side looks pretty much the same.
Views of the subframe installed
Next up is the front suspension. I'll post some pictures as I make progress. Thanks for looking!
The only place where I had some heat cracking in the bushings was at the subframe mounts for the radiator support panel. For now, I'm going to move on from that, but I might come back and replace those bushings, if I can find new ones. The 2 studs on which the bushings mount are not hard to remove.
Subframe at radiator support panel
right side radiator support mount, the left side looks pretty much the same.
Views of the subframe installed
Next up is the front suspension. I'll post some pictures as I make progress. Thanks for looking!
fury fan
Senior Member
Not to be a critic, and not that I have the skill to do it, but just to ask between friends here. Why didn't this get fixed?
Seems odd they let that go out the door based on the type of car being repaired?
Seems odd they let that go out the door based on the type of car being repaired?
1970FuryConv
Old Man with a Hat
Good question: I had a hard time finding a professional to work on this subframe out of the car. After the shop owner passed away, I agreed with his partner to do what was necessary to make the subframe structurally sound. Essentially, I took what help I could get. I expect it will align okay. As long as that happens, I think a body shop could pull that dent out later.
1970FuryConv
Old Man with a Hat
Working on Suspension and Steering now:
Long time ago I was listening to a video by Bruce Adkins on rebuilding a 440. He said, "if you don't like cleaning, get another hobby."
Upper control arms, they were not the right size for any of my tubs so I soaked them for 1 day, but one side of the arm was sticking out of the solution of rust remover, so I changed position of both upper control arms and changed the tub for day 2.
Rust Aid is $13 a gallon at Lowes so it's a lot cheaper than a gallon of carburetor cleaner.
You can tell which side of the arm wasn't in the soup. It's important to get the grease off as much is possible before you put the part in the solution. Rust remover does not remove heavy grease.
Day 2 soaking
upper ball joint bolts and offset washers after 2 days of cleaning in solution and a meeting with my wire wheel
each day the upper control arms got a scrub in my utility sink. It's right by the washing machine and dryer, so it was important to tell my wife what I was doing and also cleanup anything that dripped outside the sink.
After 48 hours and 2 scrubs in the utility sink, upper control arms look decent. They will get sprayed with brake cleaner before being painted. My friend Jerry has a shop press. Because of lacking space and infrequent need, I do not. Important to clean up the control arms so I don't mess up his press.
Upper ball joint mount on upper control arm. I'm hoping that 2 days of soaking in rust remover loosened it up.
For anyone who does not know, the upper control arms are different. The drivers side, left side, is wider on the forward arm of the control arm, marked L. I think it's also cool that the factory paint ends short of the upper ball joint.
Passenger side, right side upper control arm: the control arm is also wider on the front side of the arm.
Long time ago I was listening to a video by Bruce Adkins on rebuilding a 440. He said, "if you don't like cleaning, get another hobby."
Upper control arms, they were not the right size for any of my tubs so I soaked them for 1 day, but one side of the arm was sticking out of the solution of rust remover, so I changed position of both upper control arms and changed the tub for day 2.
Rust Aid is $13 a gallon at Lowes so it's a lot cheaper than a gallon of carburetor cleaner.
You can tell which side of the arm wasn't in the soup. It's important to get the grease off as much is possible before you put the part in the solution. Rust remover does not remove heavy grease.
Day 2 soaking
upper ball joint bolts and offset washers after 2 days of cleaning in solution and a meeting with my wire wheel
each day the upper control arms got a scrub in my utility sink. It's right by the washing machine and dryer, so it was important to tell my wife what I was doing and also cleanup anything that dripped outside the sink.
After 48 hours and 2 scrubs in the utility sink, upper control arms look decent. They will get sprayed with brake cleaner before being painted. My friend Jerry has a shop press. Because of lacking space and infrequent need, I do not. Important to clean up the control arms so I don't mess up his press.
Upper ball joint mount on upper control arm. I'm hoping that 2 days of soaking in rust remover loosened it up.
For anyone who does not know, the upper control arms are different. The drivers side, left side, is wider on the forward arm of the control arm, marked L. I think it's also cool that the factory paint ends short of the upper ball joint.
Passenger side, right side upper control arm: the control arm is also wider on the front side of the arm.
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