'67 Fury III Sport restore or restomod

donfury

donfury

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I have a '67 Fury III. It seems to be in great shape body wise (i haven't started tearing it down yet). It has a 383, auto trans (not sure which), and 8 3/4 rear. It looks very original at least to my unexperienced eye.

So I'm trying to decide if I want to restore it keeping it as original as reasonably possible. Or do a restomod on it and put a gen3 6.1/5.7 into it with a TR6060. I'm leaning towards a restomod since it seems a lot more fun. So depending on the feed back I receive here and the research it prompts me to do will decide if it's a restore or restomod.

Key things I want out of the restomod is
1. gen3 engine and manual trans
2. disk breaks front/rear
3. front/rear coilover suspension
4. lsd rearend
5. widen the stance for better handling.

the idea is to build a nice street car that i can take to the track. drum breaks won't handling the power and i'll need to tighten everthing up to improve the handling.

budget is around 40k without gas. am i dreaming or is it possible? I'll be doing most of the work in my shop. I'm no stranger to auto/metal work, just not familiar with these older cars, or well any older cars. I know there's a lot of knowledge out there so anything you can share I'd be very grateful!

been looking at things like this for the suspension setups.
MFR161056 Mopar C-Body Transformer Suspension and Frame Conversion with Coilovers, and Rack and Pinion Steering for 65-73 C-Body Mopars.
https://www.magnumforce.com/prolink-rear-suspension-for-a-b-c-and-e-body-mopars/p19
 
If you want a resto mod and Performance you are starting with the wrong car. Too much tonnage there. Get a fox body mustang or a 63 nova.
 
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413 said:
If you want a resto od and Performance you are starting with the wrong car. Too much tonnage there. Get a fox body mustang or a 63 nova
Click to expand...
This is true. I've done a foxbody before. If I could find a nice nova for a fair price I'd think about it. I'd have gone B-body but a decent b-body starts at 15k. I thought but a dart, but that's just too small a car for me. I know it's a heavy car and I won't be setting any records, but it'll still be fun to sling all that steel around. Not apposed to going changing the car, but I doubt I'll find one in as good as shape as the one I have then that price subtracts from my budget (at least for this year) so it's not really a feasible option unless a unicorn pops up.
 
Resto mod it; dream big and heavy with lots of speed

IMG_5631.jpeg
 
The issue with any resto-mod is that what one person thinks is cool might be a real turn off to somebody else. You can spend a lot of money to create your modified dream car and wind up with a very difficult car to sell should that become necessary.

Dave
 
I know that many people like the whole restomod scene. The vehicle becomes a "blank pallet" for their creativity. This is fine, BUT just remember that to sell it, you need to find somebody like yourself that you can sell it to at a good price. Otherwise, to many potential buyers of a vintage C-body or similar car, you've "ruined it" and decreased the value with your modifications you might like. BTAIM

Coil-over suspension? To me, one of the main attributes of Chrysler products is their front torsion bar suspension and how they ride and handle. With the right torsion bar rates and right HD shocks, "smooth and FIRM" are the operative words. With the designed-in front end geometry, they corner well, too. With the geometry that puts the outside wheel into negative camber in corners . . . from the factory.

The rear "stance" is as wide as it can be and not hit the body, by observation. So you can only go inward for wider tires. Unless you re-form the rear wheel well openings and inner wheel houses.

4-wheel disc brakes kits are available in the aftermarket. No problems there.

A 4-link is easier to do on those cars. In another forum about 10+ years ago, a guy did that to his '66 Newport 2-dr hardtop. Just had to do the correct measurements and fab everything up himself. Maybe put an IRS between the rear wheels, too? But to me, this takes away the main attribute of those cars, the factory suspension system.

A Gen III Hemi has been done on those cars. Some sourced salvage yard items and others did not. Late model Hemi Challengers/Chargers/300s are good sources for them, with some way to run the electronics. There are a few threads in here on such things. Now Dodge RAM V-8 pickups are good donors for the engines and ZF transmissions.

Manual transmissions might be to your liking, but a ZF 8-speed Chrysler-spec automatic can be better, with appropriate electronics to run it. You'll need something like a 3.55 or 3.91 rear axle ratio to compliment the OD gears, though. Since you're going to add an LSD, no problem.

With the 383, the automatic transmission is the ONLY one, the Chrysler 727. But as the Gen III Hemi has a LA engine bolt pattern, it will not fit the 383 without and adapter (which can be expensive).

From an "investment" orientation, a good Gen III Hemi and automatic transmission upgrade can be good to do. Plus the LSD and gears, with 4-whl power disc brakes.

The suspension can be upgraded with a new steering gearbox, sway bars, and some good HD shocks. Might lower it an inch, but one of the C-body traits is a longer rear body behind the rear wheels, so "dragging the bumper" on normal entry approaches or "dragging high center" on some steeper approaches' tops CAN happen. Best to stay at or near factory ride height so you don't have to deal with those things!

I know it can be neat to do the aftermarket suspension items you reference, BUT . . . that's just pouring more money down the hole with a car that is not going to be worth much money when all that stuff is done to it. It can be hard enough to find a restomod Mustang or Camaro buyer, even worse for, a C-body Chrysler Product. SO, be sure to insure it for what you put into it as "Agreed Value" rather than normal "market-based" insurance rates. KEY THING is to do things which will add VALUE to the car rather than trendy mods that will only be of value to a very narrow group of potential customers.

Track use? Drag strip? How about a stroker 440 New Yorker that run's insanely fast, with power steering and a/c? There's a few threads on such in here. With tires to make that happen. Road course? Size and weight can work against you there, usually, no matter the suspension or tires.

CAN you build a nice car? Certainly! A darker metallic color. A set of VN501s with 17" BFG tires. Factory ride height, as the P245/40-17s will have the same OD as the factory tires did. Engine of choice with the 8-speed ZF automatic. HD suspension items and a rear sway bar ('75-'79 Cordoba with a few tweaks). Wilwoods. A factory a/c system with Sanden upgrades. A quality sound system w/o "subs", so it isn't a rolling boombox others can be annoyed with. As always, "degree of execution" can be critical.

Just some thoughts,
CBODY67
 
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Resto mod. Gen 3. Keep it simple and tasteful. Less is more. Stockish appearing interior and exterior. If you do it right, you'll be happy and if you go to sell, it won't be hard to find a buyer.
 
donfury said:
I have a '67 Fury III. It seems to be in great shape body wise (i haven't started tearing it down yet). It has a 383, auto trans (not sure which), and 8 3/4 rear. It looks very original at least to my unexperienced eye.

So I'm trying to decide if I want to restore it keeping it as original as reasonably possible. Or do a restomod on it and put a gen3 6.1/5.7 into it with a TR6060. I'm leaning towards a restomod since it seems a lot more fun. So depending on the feed back I receive here and the research it prompts me to do will decide if it's a restore or restomod.

Key things I want out of the restomod is
1. gen3 engine and manual trans
2. disk breaks front/rear
3. front/rear coilover suspension
4. lsd rearend
5. widen the stance for better handling.

the idea is to build a nice street car that i can take to the track. drum breaks won't handling the power and i'll need to tighten everthing up to improve the handling.

budget is around 40k without gas. am i dreaming or is it possible? I'll be doing most of the work in my shop. I'm no stranger to auto/metal work, just not familiar with these older cars, or well any older cars. I know there's a lot of knowledge out there so anything you can share I'd be very grateful!

been looking at things like this for the suspension setups.
MFR161056 Mopar C-Body Transformer Suspension and Frame Conversion with Coilovers, and Rack and Pinion Steering for 65-73 C-Body Mopars.
https://www.magnumforce.com/prolink-rear-suspension-for-a-b-c-and-e-body-mopars/p19
Click to expand...
First, before someone starts calling me "purist" (not you) I'm not. I like some resto-mods and some I don't like.

IMHO, why don't you just get the car running and driving... Go out and have some fun with it before you start pulling it apart.

I also don't think that $40k is realistic. You have almost a 1/4 of that in a suspension "kit". Mopars are expensive.. and the **** that they say will fit probably won't or if it does, it was engineered for some GM and it hasn't done anything to make the car any better. With what you are planning, I'd say you're off by a factor of at least two... and that's figuring you can do all the work. I didn't read any plans to stiffen the uni-body either.

Seriously, if this is your first old car, try enjoying it as an old car first before you make it a new car with old sheet metal. One of the things I love about my old cars is they aren't like new cars...
 
As "alike" as modern cars might be, that was not the case in the 1960s. Each brand had their own feels in how they operated, how they handled, and all of that. With some differences even within their own different models, but they all usually had a "family feel" to them. Fords were different from GMs and Chryslers, although they all performed the same "appliance" functions. The "efficiency" which all Chrysler products had in how they did things back then is one reason I like them. The efficiency of the Torque Flite automatic in how it responds to throttle inputs at highway speeds. The efficiency of how the car responds to steering inputs and corners without nearly the same degree of understeer that GMs and especially Fords did. Plus generally better fuel economy with the stock gearing. Everything worked together as "a package". I also liked the seats as they seemed to feel better to me than anything which Ford or GM had. Somebody in Chrysler interior design did a lot of things right. Seats to sit in for hours, rather than sitting "on" them. Those were good times and memories!

If you've never been around "old cars" much, you need to spend some time and miles getting to know them. Many were "art on wheels" as others were more mundane in appearance and operation. Yet with the right mix of colors, chrome, powertrain choices, they could be magical conveyances in which you could cover long distances and arrive refreshed at the destination. Moreso with the fancier models than the less-optiioned ones. I discovered that after I spent hours at a time driving our '66 Newport, I came to better appreciate the chassis dynamics with nothing more than a good set of HD shocks on it. Firm and solid, with responsive steering, even on the old bias-ply belted tires we had back then (inflated to 30-32psi). At 70mph, it was "bored" on the Interstate or US Highways. At 75mph, it felt happy and enjoyed a "natural" cruising speed (when possible) of 75-90. Engine dynamics, chassis calibrations, contributed to this feel. 95mph was too fast, though. With 2.76 rear gears on the 2bbl 383, 90mph was just past the peak of the torque curve, so everything it did was easy, as to freeway running. Didn't have to really slow down for curves, either, unless they got too sharp or caution prevailed.

Certainly, some modernizations can happen. Electronic ignition is one, as is self-learning EFI and letting the EFI controller also control the ignition timing. With most EFI systems, you need a matching distributor anyway. You can configure the fuel supply items to coincide with what the Gen III Hemi system needs, too.

The "ammeter bypass" is another thing to do in the interest of longevity, too.

Some people get something new and immediately start cutting, whacking, and such to do "new things" to the car. The problem is that sometimes they ruin some pretty good OEM engineering in the process. This is why learning about what the vehicle platform really is, how it is different from others, and how robust it might (or might not be) be compared to aftermarket "stuff". Ford, GM, Chrysler, and others prioritized where they spent money and where they did not. NOTHING was generic, or as generic as some suspected it might be. Just a glance will not indicate these things, from my experiences.

Putting my '67 Chrysler Newport next to a '68 Buick LeSabre reveals some astounding differences in body engineering and style. Where the Chrysler has small-radius, tight, even 90-degree bent sheet metal contours, the Buick has large-radius, soft curves (as many GM cars had back then . . . cheaper to produce). The center a/c vent in the Buick only moves up and down, whereas the Chrysler's divided center vent moves laterally (on each side). Materials in the Buick are "cost-engineered" too, but still look nice. The Chrysler trim codes had a pearl finish, with metallic yarns in the fabrics, too, for an extra sparkle. Ford and GM used just "colors". Lots of little things many people did not notice, but they were there if they should notice.

Y'all enjoy!
CBODY67
 
Big_John said:
First, before someone starts calling me "purist" (not you) I'm not. I like some resto-mods and some I don't like.

IMHO, why don't you just get the car running and driving... Go out and have some fun with it before you start pulling it apart.

I also don't think that $40k is realistic. You have almost a 1/4 of that in a suspension "kit". Mopars are expensive.. and the **** that they say will fit probably won't or if it does, it was engineered for some GM and it hasn't done anything to make the car any better. With what you are planning, I'd say you're off by a factor of at least two... and that's figuring you can do all the work. I didn't read any plans to stiffen the uni-body either.

Seriously, if this is your first old car, try enjoying it as an old car first before you make it a new car with old sheet metal. One of the things I love about my old cars is they aren't like new cars...
Click to expand...
This sounds like solid advice. I have a tendency to take stuff apart and put it back together when I get it, when I look at this car I just see so much potential for awesome. Not saying it isn't great stock/original but there have been so many improvements over the years. Improving handling and stopping power being my biggest concern. Which could probably be done without the extreme modifications in the links. But the drum breaks will have to go for sure, I refuse to work on them. Doing it steps might be the better idea.
 
@CBODY67
Thanks for the knowledge dump. That's a lot to think about. I do know that if I replace the eng/trans it'll get a manual trans, nothing replaces the feel of shifting gears backed up with plenty of hp. I don't have much interest in drag, but it'd be nice to just test the numbers. The goal will be to make something fun, powerful, comfortable, and controllable. For the street and track, road tracks.

Can you point me to a good 4 wheel disk break kit? When I start this summer that's where I'll begin.
 
donfury said:
nice! would love to see more as you progress. what's your plan for it?
Click to expand...
I’ll make a thread here in a few weeks when I get a little headway on the progress; but the basics are 505 ci stroker with EFI, TF 727 with manual reverse valve body built to handle the additional hp, 4 wheel Wilwood disk brakes with hydroboost, USCT frame connectors and torque boxes, just about all the Firm Feel goodies (sway bars, bigger torsion bars, drop spindles, etc) and aftermarket wheels (will probably end up with different ones than in the picture) and some modifications to the body. Probably going to paint it cavalry blue as well.
 
TX67FURY said:
I’ll make a thread here in a few weeks when I get a little headway on the progress; but the basics are 505 ci stroker with EFI, TF 727 with manual reverse valve body built to handle the additional hp, 4 wheel Wilwood disk brakes with hydroboost, USCT frame connectors and torque boxes, just about all the Firm Feel goodies (sway bars, bigger torsion bars, drop spindles, etc) and aftermarket wheels (will probably end up with different ones than in the picture) and some modifications to the body. Probably going to paint it cavalry blue as well.
Click to expand...
if you get the time can you drop links for those suspension parts and the disk breaks set?
 
Many in here like the OEM Chrysler items which are bolt-on spindles and such. The Imperial rear wheel disc brakes can be problematic to source, so aftermarket on the rear. Using an appropriate OEM-sourced brake booster is important, too.

I know the Wilwood disc brake kits have lots of applications, which is good. I remember when they first started selling light-weight kits for drag cars in the 1980s or so. Light weight was a key component on a drag car and they hit that with their products. BTAIM

There are a few threads in here on what models of Chrysler C-bodies to salvage yard shop for to get the complete front power disc brake systems from. These kits just look more robust than any aftermarket system does, to me. Chrysler used a little-bit different modulation mechanism to balance the front-rear pressures than GM did, so this can be a consideration, too, in the salvage yard searches. I suspect you could plumb it like a GM-style system with an adjustable proportioning valve to replace the OEM valves and such?

One advantage the Wilwood system has would be (hopefully) consistent availability of parts. OEM stuff is great, but the salvage yards can tend to be a dwindling supply of used parts, plus things similar in sourcing replacement rotors and such. As demand falls, the replacement companies will sell out and build no more, unless they have consistent sales.

When I found the Scarebird parts website, using existing auto supply parts to do disc brake conversion kits, I thought that was great. But the replacement supplier "no sales, no new parts" has kicked in so his recommendations for parts applications has changed due to this. Another reason that Wilwood can make sense. Especially for rotors. Several considerations, always looking to the future as to availability of parts.

There are a few Mopar-specific steering gear options. Firm-Feel and Steer & Gear are the main ones who can rebuild your existing box to various performance levels. Plus stiffer torsion bars, sway bars, and shock options. Borgeson can be another supplier, as they adapt a later-model Jeep steering box to the earlier cars for a "modern feel". Several options there.

A main reason the pro tourers went to the coil-over front suspension had more to do with ease of tuning the spring rates (just as with similar systems on dirt track cars) AND to get space for exhaust system items. But with the shorter springs, which have to be stiffer as a result, that also means shock calibration can become more intense as the stiffer springs also need tighter valving in the shocks to compensate for that. That, plus earlier bump stop intervention on the extension (especially) of the shocks, gets us to where we are today. Whereas in prior times, the factory ride height was "in the middle" of the suspension travel, for all vehicles.

In modern times, it's not unusual to see a GM pickup go through a dip and see the front wheels come off the ground on the end of the dip. This due to the restricted extension travel of the coil-over suspension. In the '70s, if front wheels came off the ground in that same driving situation, speeds would have had to be stupidly-insane by comparison. Wheels-on-the-road means more potential driver control of the vehicle, if needed. Which is where good shock tuning comes into play.

Take care,
CBODY67
 
donfury said:
if you get the time can you drop links for those suspension parts and the disk breaks set?
Click to expand...
1965-1973 C-BODY - this will allow you to keep the original suspension design but upgrade a lot of the components

Wilwood Disc Brakes 140-15200-DR Wilwood Forged Narrow Superlite 6R Big Brake Front Brake Kits | Summit Racing - dang these have gone up since I’ve purchased them.

https://www.speedwaymotors.com/Wilw...Kit-Mopar-Dana-2-50-Off-Snap-Ring,105634.html I think these are what I went with; but just double check their fitment for our cars.
 
We get a few of these threads per year.
'Bought my first C-body, don't know anything about them, and want to treat it all apart, remove the fabulous factory suspension's engineering, and turn this car into something it's not (nor will ever be).' Then the main question is 'tell me everything I need to know to do all of this?'

The factory suspension is far superior to anything available back then. Other companies used leafsprings, but nobody optimized them like Chrysler did.
The torsion bars are also an extremely good system.
You best bet is to peruse FirmFeel and see what's available and what that costs. X3 in cost to retrofit something else that likely won't work much better, if at all.

Most resto-mods are are not worth the cost to build them (as far as the inevitable resale).
Without seeing pics of the car, you might be poised to destroy a really nice old car.
 
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