Electric Car Rant.............sort of

[moparnutcase]

Ok, I know there are people out there who think electric cars are neat,techy,or what ever,more power(pun intended) to you. But what really gets me laughing are the gullible jack a$$es who think they are helping the environment. Had discussions with several of these owners in the past.......my first question to them is "do you charge your car by solar or wind power 100% of the time? The usual answer is no. Then I hit them with the second question. "where do you think the electric comes from to charge your car? Majority of the time is a blank stare......
Which leads me to this cartoon that was in the editorial section of my paper today...same idea.

 

[jake]

Easier to clean from one source then 500 million. Dont get me wrong, I love my car like my 3rd child, but the Tesla roadster is impressive.

 

[moparnutcase]

Pollution is pollution no matter where it comes from.....

 

[Davea Lux]

Electric cars are not all that earth friendly when the costs to produce them are considered. Mining the Nickle and the Cadmium and refining these elements in the composite used in EV actually consume a significant amount of the energy as these cars are supposed to save. Then of course we have to consider the power generation costs.

www.bloomberg.com/view/articles/2017-07-04/china-s-electric-cars-are-actually-pretty-dirty

Dave

 

[cantflip]

Don't forget the disposal of the batteries...

 

[Yatzee]

Ok, I know there are people out there who think electric cars are neat,techy,or what ever,more power(pun intended) to you. But what really gets me laughing are the gullible jack a$$es who think they are helping the environment. Had discussions with several of these owners in the past.......my first question to them is "do you charge your car by solar or wind power 100% of the time? The usual answer is no. Then I hit them with the second question. "where do you think the electric comes from to charge your car? Majority of the time is a blank stare......
Which leads me to this cartoon that was in the editorial section of my paper today...same idea. View attachment 154579

I seriously think it's time you moved into the 21st century or overhauled your sense of reasoning. All things given, the issue with even modern cars is hydrocarbons. Take those away and you making enviromental progress. And who doesn't want to leave a clean future to their kids and grandchildren. Unless your electricity comes from a dirty old coal burning generator plant the emmisions from the production of electricity is far cleaner than a few million poorly maintained vehicles wandering the roads. It's even worse in high density area like New York, Chicago and Los Angeles. Electric cars do have their place in modern society and even their batteries can be refurbished to produce less toxic waste. Can't say that about glycol, transmission fluid, engine oil and battery acid. Where the hell does this stuff end up anyway? Anybody?

 

[BigblueC]

transmission fluid, engine oil... Where the hell does this stuff end up anyway? Anybody?

Collected, reprocessed/refined, then sold as bulk oil and put right back into service at you nearest Jiffy Lube or similar. Oils don't "wear out", just become contaminated.

 

[65sporty]

Can't say that about glycol, transmission fluid, engine oil and battery acid. Where the hell does this stuff end up anyway? Anybody?

Glycol can be recycled, any oil's end up in our waste oil furnace at work, all batteries are picked up as cores and recycled

 

[Davea Lux]

Glycol can be recycled, any oil's end up in our waste oil furnace at work, all batteries are picked up as cores and recycled

Agreed. The main issue with the Nickel composite batteries used in EVs is that it takes more resources to recycle that waste than it takes to make new ones.

Dave

 

[LocuMob]

Electric cars take an amazing amount of resources to make. I'll take my old cars any day.

 

[jct]

I'll take my old cars any day.

And they are cheaper to maintain in the long run

 

[jake]

My horse will run all day on a couple oats,,,,
Your steam engine will will run out of water.....
My steam engine has unlimited resources, water and wood.....
Your gasoline power car relies on a finite resource I can't make.....
My gasoline power car will let me drive 6000 miles as long as there is a gas station....
Your battery power car only let's u drive 400 miles....
Etc....... Modern evolution.

 

[CBODY67]

My horse will run all day on a couple oats,,,,
Your steam engine will will run out of water.....
My steam engine has unlimited resources, water and wood.....
Your gasoline power car relies on a finite resource I can't make.....
My gasoline power car will let me drive 6000 miles as long as there is a gas station....
Your battery power car only let's u drive 400 miles....
Etc....... Modern evolution.

Horses produce a different type of pollution. Not only the semi-solid kind, but methane from "internal processing processes". At one time, there were orientations to limit the number of livestock which a rancher could own, until the ranchers/beef producers complained. More living warm-blooded beings on this earth means more CO2 production.

Full electric cars aren't quite ready for ALL consumers, just yet. Price is still to high, as is the novelty value of them. Lots of charging stations, though. There's a website that shows most of them.

Coal can be made cleaner to burn, with fewer smokestack emissions, but natural gas is far cleaner, which is where most of the new-generation generator plants are moving toward, looking at the long range, rather than just the next three years. Even China is now moving away from coal!

The Sunny Racer Challenge is a yearly competition between major college engineering students for solar powered vehicles. It was going on well before the current grid expansion of solar and wind energy farms.

CBODY67

 

[Alchemi]

And they have just figured how to make oil that a normal refinery can process from water and sunlight via algae

Nature releases way more co2 than humans - what we have done is screwed over its way of getting rid of it, Saw a bit on the news the other day where we can help that with kelp farms, you can use the kelp for any number of things - construction materials to food, it pulls all the carbon out of the ocean, which is where the real issue is.

In the state where i live here in OZ they charge registration based on number of cylinders, If its a hybrid you pay the same as a 4cy - considering installing a small electric motor on the diff for parking - would save me over $500 a year lols

 

[moparnutcase]

I seriously think it's time you moved into the 21st century or overhauled your sense of reasoning. All things given, the issue with even modern cars is hydrocarbons. Take those away and you making enviromental progress. And who doesn't want to leave a clean future to their kids and grandchildren. Unless your electricity comes from a dirty old coal burning generator plant the emmisions from the production of electricity is far cleaner than a few million poorly maintained vehicles wandering the roads. It's even worse in high density area like New York, Chicago and Los Angeles. Electric cars do have their place in modern society and even their batteries can be refurbished to produce less toxic waste. Can't say that about glycol, transmission fluid, engine oil and battery acid. Where the hell does this stuff end up anyway? Anybody?

My reasoning is already stated.........unless the electricity is coming from 100% solar or wind then the power is coming from a fossil fuel burning plant.....hence STILL creating emissions and not solving anything. I think you need to grow some common sense, because as I have been seeing lately....common sense is NOT so common. And it is all summed up in the comic I posted, no explanation needed.

 

[CanCritter]

way l understand it is on one city block there is only enough power available/transferable for 3 electric cars per block...any more cars and electrical transformers would need to be upgraded...takes 2 years to build 1 transformer....imput most welcome...not the last word here

 

[Davea Lux]

Horses produce a different type of pollution. Not only the semi-solid kind, but methane from "internal processing processes". At one time, there were orientations to limit the number of livestock which a rancher could own, until the ranchers/beef producers complained. More living warm-blooded beings on this earth means more CO2 production.

Full electric cars aren't quite ready for ALL consumers, just yet. Price is still to high, as is the novelty value of them. Lots of charging stations, though. There's a website that shows most of them.

Coal can be made cleaner to burn, with fewer smokestack emissions, but natural gas is far cleaner, which is where most of the new-generation generator plants are moving toward, looking at the long range, rather than just the next three years. Even China is now moving away from coal!

The Sunny Racer Challenge is a yearly competition between major college engineering students for solar powered vehicles. It was going on well before the current grid expansion of solar and wind energy farms.

CBODY67

In the early 1900's, New York city had several thousand public sanitation workers (mostly Irish) removing organic waste from the city streets. The automobile was viewed as the "clean" alternative to the hundreds of tons of horse manure being deposited on city streets weekly. Many new technologies replace one type of pollution for another. If Tesla's Lithium-Ion battery program has any chance of success, vast new sources of Lithium will need to discovered as they do not currently exist. Does this mean that we will strip mine vast areas of the planet, and if so what will be the cost of this new clean technology? Many of the byproducts of mining are highly toxic and pose many long term health concerns.

Methane and CO2 are produced in abundance by natural processes on the planet. Humans contribute at last estimate something like 5% of these materials to the totals produced. Forests remove CO2 from the atmosphere as do ocean plants and algae. Methane is an unstable hydrocarbon that eventually breaks down into CO2 and Water. Vast amounts of methane are also dissolved in sea water in the deep ocean. The eruption of the Krackatoa volcano in the mid 1800's saw the release of more CO2, Methane and particulate matter that all human activity to date, and guess what, the world did not end. The whole climate change agenda is a means to an end by totalitarian groups who wish to control all aspects of daily life. For some really sobering reading, pick up a copy of UN Agenda 21, they are very open about what they wish to accomplish.
In the mean time, I would suggest planting a tree.

Dave

 

[commando1]

I'm sorry but it's pretty hard for me to buy the notion I'm helping... Keyword: Helping... the planet as a consumer by buying more expensive alternative energy.
Everything added up gets wiped out by one Chinese cargo ship spewing their crap into the environment delivering one load for Walmart.
This is crazy.

 

[Davea Lux]

I'm sorry but it's pretty hard for me to buy the notion I'm helping... Keyword: Helping... the planet as a consumer by buying more expensive alternative energy.
Everything added up gets wiped out by one Chinese cargo ship spewing their crap into the environment delivering one load for Walmart.
This is crazy.

At last, someone else understands.

Dave

 

[saforwardlook]

My reasoning is already stated.........unless the electricity is coming from 100% solar or wind then the power is coming from a fossil fuel burning plant.....hence STILL creating emissions and not solving anything. I think you need to grow some common sense, because as I have been seeing lately....common sense is NOT so common. And it is all summed up in the comic I posted, no explanation needed.

Solar and wind energy sources are on the rise, and having more electric cars will speed deployment of those sources (which are the ultimate goal - you don't just get to the goal in one month - it may take decades yet, and we have to start somewhere) and the overwhelming source of energy for electrical generating plants in places like California is from natural gas, not coal or oil. The ultimate goal of burning more and more fossil fuels is also well known, at least to the scientists that actually know what they are talking about. And I am tired of making the Middle East wealthy and always being in continual huge resource draining wars to keep the oil flowing from the crazies over there. Maybe some of them wouldn't be so crazy if they actually had to work for a living rather than just sell oil they pumped out of the ground.

Building more electric cars also reduces their prices due to economies of scale kicking in over time. And technology will evolve more rapidly as more and more are built. Today's Tesla will recharge to 80% of capacity in 20 minutes at present (good for another 240 miles). That too will improve over time. It really doesn't matter if you agree with it or not, or believe you have better judgment than all the auto company engineers and strategists, all the major automakers are on the EV path. They have done all the studies too, and that is their conclusion. And some cities are claiming they will ban combustion vehicles from their city centers by 2030, places in China and Europe. I was just at the Los Angeles auto show, and it is really mind boggling how fast industry is moving in the direction of EVs. And battery recycling is a major component of all the current studies. Auto companies have some pretty capable people working for them that make these kinds of decisions, otherwise they wouldn't last long in this incredibly competitive industry. Ford's new CEO, who replaced Mark Fields because the latter wasn't making enough return for the shareholders investment (stock dividends) announced that somewhere in the mid 2020s or earlier, there will be no further investment at Ford in developing combustion engines for light duty vehicles.

I personally would not rely on my common sense being so much better than the real experts because some cartoonist also believes he too is wiser than all the engineers, scientists, accountants, and strategists the auto companys employ to keep competitive in this merciless industry.