Firm feel Power steering box

[Trace 300 Hurst]

Sorry for the confusion, but I'm just trying to be clear. I almost ordered that Lare 217 that I do not need.

I think we're having a problem of using the right words. In your first post, you wrote "I plan to stick w the Chrysler rubber coupler also, having obtained the Lares replacement rubber from Rock, and a rebuild kit from Ehrenberg's ePay store."

Certainly you can see how this is confusing, as you somewhat mixed the Lares item (which is an insulator, not a coupler) with "Chrysler rubber coupler", which is what the rag joint is mostly made of: Rubber.

And I must point out that here is no "insulator" in the pot coupling. If you look at this site Moparts on the Web - Main Index or the FSM you'll see the guts of the coupler that are sold by lots of vendors to rebuild it, including Ehrenberg. But if you look at the top diagram, you'll see an "insulator" that goes at the bottom of the steering column guts. Now I realize that's what the Lare's guy was talking to me about....#217. And you're right...it's not a rag joint.

The rag joint rebuilding kit from PerformanceOnline that you provided the link to indicates that it's for GM cars, 1964-88. Do you know if it will work to rebuild a Chrysler rag joint?

 

[Gerald Morris]

Sorry for the confusion, but I'm just trying to be clear. I almost ordered that Lare 217 that I do not need.

I think we're having a problem of using the right words. In your first post, you wrote "I plan to stick w the Chrysler rubber coupler also, having obtained the Lares replacement rubber from Rock, and a rebuild kit from Ehrenberg's ePay store."

Certainly you can see how this is confusing, as you somewhat mixed the Lares item (which is an insulator, not a coupler) with "Chrysler rubber coupler", which is what the rag joint is mostly made of: Rubber.

And I must point out that here is no "insulator" in the pot coupling. If you look at this site Moparts on the Web - Main Index or the FSM you'll see the guts of the coupler that are sold by lots of vendors to rebuild it, including Ehrenberg. But if you look at the top diagram, you'll see an "insulator" that goes at the bottom of the steering column guts. Now I realize that's what the Lare's guy was talking to me about....#217. And you're right...it's not a rag joint.

The rag joint rebuilding kit from PerformanceOnline that you provided the link to indicates that it's for GM cars, 1964-88. Do you know if it will work to rebuild a Chrysler rag joint?

They stipulate if you get the shaft measurements, diameter and splines right, it should be good for anything.

There is a suprising (to some) number of GM parts which will fit Mopar products of the Classic (1950-78) period! This includes pistons, suspension, steering (Saginaw pumps and other parts) wiring et cetera. The headlight harness in Mathilda was made by FOMOCO (Ford) of all people too! The reason for this is historically obvious: WW 2 required that American crapitalists adhere to STANDARDS to produce machinery of use to the armed forces. Consequently, cylinder bores, connecting rods, valve dimensions, even crankshafts were oft interchangeable. GM and Chrysler, as the up-and-comers of the day, adhered better to this spirit than Ford, which had ideological aversion to Nazi-hunting as well as Federal regulation.

My BIG REASON for owning and driving a 1966 MOPAR arises from the relative ease of maintenance and repair combined with lack of State oversight. Mopar did it BEST, hands down in design and quality during the Classic/Golden Age of Detroit Iron. 1966 was the zenith year for this: the bugs were worked out and the Fed regs had yet to begin. I pray I can pass Mathilda down to my progeny, recently born to a millennial bride. So long as I can get a bare income for us, I should be able to, God-willing.

 

[Trace 300 Hurst]

They stipulate if you get the shaft measurements, diameter and splines right, it should be good for anything.

Ahhh...good point, good info. So, does anyone know these measurements and spline counts so we can order BEFORE we take the rag apart?

 

[Mike66Chryslers]

Regarding the rubber steering coupler, what about using the Land Rover NTC3486 part? Other members that have used it say that, with a small amount of work, it is a good replacement for the original.

Steering coupler needed

 

[Gerald Morris]

Regarding the rubber steering coupler, what about using the Land Rover NTC3486 part? Other members that have used it say that, with a small amount of work, it is a good replacement for the original.

Steering coupler needed

If the price is right, then do it! BUT, if one can get the appropriate part for a fair price, go that way I say.

 

[Polara_500]

If the price is right, then do it! BUT, if one can get the appropriate part for a fair price, go that way I say.

That's the problem - only one guy we know of has any left and he's real proud of them to the tune of two hundred bucks each. So the price isn't fair and that's why everyone is looking for an alternative.

 

[Gerald Morris]

More on the insulator...

As can be seen in the add linked below, the insulator looks a lot like it goes inside that pot.

Here is the Mopar insulator I found on ePay:

Steering Coupling Power CHRYSLER Dodge Plymouth Aftermarket Replaces# 1822668 | eBay

And here is what Rock is peddling for Lares, the 217:

https://www.rockauto.com/en/moreinfo.php?pk=8889868&cc=1412446&jsn=298

Oh Really Auto sells the Lares 217 for $63, and asserts it fits my Newport among a few other Mopar landbarges too.

https://www.oreillyauto.com/detail/.../lares-steering-coupling-assembly/217/5763959

It might just be a good bit of rubber to replace when replacing the steering gear, idler arm & such.....

 

[Polara_500]

And this one here is the one everybody else is talking about........ along with the known source.
1965-73 300 Fury Polara Monaco Chrysler NOS MoPar Steering Rag Joint Coupler | eBay

 

[SF-66TC]

Is it really worth the price of admission?
The charge for it is $420 for the stage 2 and a 250 core charge. Is that price worth the upgrade from a rebuilt standard box. Is it night and day? Will my wagon steer much better than a rebuilt box from autozone or Napa for $120

Have you gotten your steering box rebuilt yet? Do you have Power Steering or Manual Steering? IMO and experience go with Firm Feel. I have a '66 TC wagon with Power Steering and had my box rebuilt with a Stage-1 in Feb of 2016. If you want more of a Rack & Pinion feel I'd suggest getting a Stage-2 or Stage-3.

Send yours in to get rebuilt so you won't have to pay the core charge. Shipping to them from SF, CA was $34 UPS. FF only charged me $25 to ship it back.

Read my post here - https://www.forcbodiesonly.com/mopar-forum/conversations/firm-feel-steering-box.45116/#message-49085

 

[68 4spd Fury]

I replaced my steering box earlier this year and couldn't decide which route to take either.
i figured up the shipping and core charges, and i ended up going with the borgeson box. A little overkill, but i like it. Just drove it this weekend at 70 mph with zero wandering.
When i pulled my column out, my actual problem was the biscuit was shot and causing the scary steering. So don't overlook that as a potential problem.

Hopefully not a completely stupid question, what is the biscuit?

 

[Trace 300 Hurst]

Hopefully not a completely stupid question, what is the biscuit?

Wow, what a completely stupid question!

It's the rubber coupler or "rag joint" that has been talked about in this thread.

 

[68 4spd Fury]

Wow, what a completely stupid question!

It's the rubber coupler or "rag joint" that has been talked about in this thread.

Glad to provide a laugh, never heard the term before.

 

[Trace 300 Hurst]

Glad to provide a laugh, never heard the term before.

Actually, I knew it as "biscuit" decades before I heard "rag joint". I guess you and I are both stupid!

 

[polarus]

Has anybody tried the solid replacement style? I think Bouchillon Performance makes them.

 

[Gerald Morris]

FWIW, I ordered the LandRover biscuit. $12 beats $200 any day, especially when the high price is for rubber that may be as old as the car its going into.....

 

[saforwardlook]

FWIW, I ordered the LandRover biscuit. $12 beats $200 any day, especially when the high price is for rubber that may be as old as the car its going into.....

I bought a bunch of them too. Very inexpensive. They work just fine with very minor modifications. They are as close to the originals in appearance and function as anything else I searched for. Nothing else even close.

Who needs all the suspension stuff telegraphed into the car via the steering column using a solid steel coupler instead?

 

[Dan Scully]

Have you gotten your steering box rebuilt yet? Do you have Power Steering or Manual Steering? IMO and experience go with Firm Feel. I have a '66 TC wagon with Power Steering and had my box rebuilt with a Stage-1 in Feb of 2016. If you want more of a Rack & Pinion feel I'd suggest getting a Stage-2 or Stage-3.

Send yours in to get rebuilt so you won't have to pay the core charge. Shipping to them from SF, CA was $34 UPS. FF only charged me $25 to ship it back.

Read my post here - https://www.forcbodiesonly.com/mopar-forum/conversations/firm-feel-steering-box.45116/#message-49085

I sent a extra box I had for my 64 wagon, I can install it when time permits once I get it back. Drove a friends 64 sport fury with a stage 2 box. Really liked the feedback so I went with a stage 2 for the wagon.

 

[Mike66Chryslers]

That's the problem - only one guy we know of has any left and he's real proud of them to the tune of two hundred bucks each. So the price isn't fair and that's why everyone is looking for an alternative.

Before the Chrysler bankruptcy, you could still buy the rubber couplers brand new at the Chrysler dealer parts counter, but the last one I bought was $100 CDN at that time.

The good news for anybody forking out $200 US for an "NOS" one is that they're probably closer to 10 years old, not 50.

 

[Gerald Morris]

I bought a bunch of them too. Very inexpensive. They work just fine with very minor modifications. They are as close to the originals in appearance and function as anything else I searched for. Nothing else even close.

Who needs all the suspension stuff telegraphed into the car via the steering column using a solid steel coupler instead?

Right! Think of how all that VIBRATION plays hell w your turn signal switch and other parts of the steering wheel assembly. I would like a poly urethane coupler if its not too hard, but only IF.

Another possibility would be to machine a big rubber lab stopper. Were it not for the LandRover coupler, that would have been my course. Be nice to get some durometer readings on an NOS Mopar coupler for comparison first though....

 

[Tyler King]

That is a comparison picture of Borgeson and oem Part. The Borgeson Box is smaller and light whigt compared to the OE Box. It has a quicker Ratio (approximativ. half a Turn less lock to lock). It has no noticable lash and requires slightly higher Steering effort. This swap is still not like a new vehicle with rack and pinion steering. You would Need to modify complete frontend.
You would also Need to have a good ps pump. I followed the borgeson recommendation and bought a new pump and hose set all at once. I like the new steering feel. I feel much safer than before with a cardone rebuild box which was horrible.

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That looks like it definitely provides more clearance all around for after market headers and swaps correct? Just curious would you have an idea of how much smaller the new box is in width and height etc??