Mr C
Senior Member
I think there is sediment clogging the sock on the pick up in the tank. As Commando said, the system should work...it does on all of my cars/ truck.
fuel pump pushrod access plug question
- Thread starter saylor
- Start date
saylor
Senior Member
1966Newport maybe wins.
the electric pump starved for gas after about 20 seconds of running.
The next thing, last thing, only thing left, is the sending unit.
Everything else is new.
im trying to be positive about the whole experience, now when I get the 670hp motor im wired for an electric fuel pump...
Funship32
New Member
Let us know what comes of this...pls.
commando1
Old Man with a Hat
Where did you install the electric fuel pump, anyway?
Speed_Kills96
Member
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okay, now if the fuel pump starved of gas 20 seconds after running it, chances are the pump is now damaged. These pumps have to have gas flowing through them or else they will overheat and lock up. Therefore the pump must be installed inside the fuel tank, attached to the sending unit, this way gas is always keeping the pump cool. Earlier you mentioned that the gas boils in the lines after the car heats up, so that leads me to think that the gas lines are too close to the manifold and the engine block, therefore causing vapor lock. Route the gas lines away from the very hot areas on the engine such as exhaust manifolds, radiator hoses, and make sure that they are routed by the areas that contain the least heat.
I do not have a picture of what this looks like, but i'm sure that someone else can help you out with a picture.
saylor
Senior Member
I mounted the electric FP back by the passenger rear wheel on the outside of the frame.
I never said the gas is boiling, it goes away. you can watch it at the clear filter, it just goes from full to empty. It always happened at operating temp ~180* +.
With the electric pump, all the heat is taken out of the question. I jumpered 30 and 87 on the relay and ran the pump without the car on. it pumped for about 20 seconds and stopped getting gas.
the sending unit will be here tomorrow. that is the only component left in the fuel system that hasn't been changed.
if that doesn't fix it im pushing it off a cliff.
I never did check the FP for pressure with a gauge.
if the electric pump is fried ill go get another one its still under warranty.
im worried about pressure @ the carb and if I need a regulator or not. we'll see.
I never said the gas is boiling, it goes away. you can watch it at the clear filter, it just goes from full to empty. It always happened at operating temp ~180* +.
With the electric pump, all the heat is taken out of the question. I jumpered 30 and 87 on the relay and ran the pump without the car on. it pumped for about 20 seconds and stopped getting gas.
the sending unit will be here tomorrow. that is the only component left in the fuel system that hasn't been changed.
if that doesn't fix it im pushing it off a cliff.
I never did check the FP for pressure with a gauge.
if the electric pump is fried ill go get another one its still under warranty.
im worried about pressure @ the carb and if I need a regulator or not. we'll see.
Funship32
New Member
Well I know I'm wading in a little late but here is what I would do to troubleshoot the problem: You have the same problem with a mech fuel pump and an electric one, so I feel that you can safely rule out the pump. If in your boat, I would now take a long stretch of hose that is hooked up to inlet side of your pump, and run it into a can of some sort that has fuel in it, even if it is a 1 or 2 gal fuel can. Now I know what I'm going to say is obvious but I'm just say'in for those that read this and don't know the 'obvious' ...whatever can you use, don't use a glass jar, keep said can far away from any ignition sources and keep the hose away from any heat that can melt said hose. Also, do this OUTSIDE and not in your garage and by all means: keep a fire extinguisher handy. Best to have 2 people just in case- one to hold the hose and keep the extiinguiser handy while you check what is going on. Anyway by doing such, you remove the tank and pickup from the mix. If it IS a heat problem you can bird dog it down from there 'cause the same problem will show up. If the car runs fine, they you've found your problem- something in the pickup assy is causing you grief. Just my 2 cents....
saylor
Senior Member
I think the sending unit is/ was the reason. i changed the sending unit today and then ran the car up to temp and never ran out of fuel at the filter yet. hopefully now it can stay running and i can tune the carb mixtures and idle speed. i could not really SEE anything wrong with the old sending unit, except maybe the sock was collapsing and blocking the pickup tube inlet. The old sock literally broke apart in my hands it was so old. the new sending unit tubing was shaped differently, a bit longer, but fit right in and looks like it is giving accurate gauge reading at the dash. I changed it all from under the car, didn't even have to raise it. Soaked everything in PB blaster. undid all the fixtures. made a sending unit ring removal tool out of 2" PVC, and popped that sucker off there.
I did try to run it out of a gas can, with the mechanical fuel pump, and it would not pump gas from the can. it was a new pump airtex #267 from summit.
the electric pump looks like it is going to do the job. I had to bleed the fuel system of air, it would not pump gas up to the carb. i undid the hose up near the carb and it popped like opening a soda can. I ran the electric pump and filled up to the see through filter by the carb, then connected the hose back on to the carb.
so far so good.
I did try to run it out of a gas can, with the mechanical fuel pump, and it would not pump gas from the can. it was a new pump airtex #267 from summit.
the electric pump looks like it is going to do the job. I had to bleed the fuel system of air, it would not pump gas up to the carb. i undid the hose up near the carb and it popped like opening a soda can. I ran the electric pump and filled up to the see through filter by the carb, then connected the hose back on to the carb.
so far so good.
Looks like the problem is solved.
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Don't be shocked if it does the same thing again, you still haven't gotten rid of the sediment in the tank and its likely to do the same thing again. Some of the sediment is probably magnetic, maybe even most of it and if it is you can control it by getting some strong hardware store magnets and attaching them to the lowest part of the outside of the tank. This will keep the sediment from floating around and eventually being drawn to the suction at the sock.
saylor
Senior Member
totally agreed. if it does it again its all coming off and ill get all new tank and straps and stuff. starving of gas is dumb.
Detroit_Lives
Member
I'm pretty sure you'll get better gas mileage with those magnets on there too... its like a paranormal phenonmanum, phenonunum, you know....supernatural magnetic gas milage booster magnets..
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Lol! that was very clever of you.
saylor
Senior Member
allright! digging up an old post... its getting hot in texas, and i think i still have fuel heat issues. im gonna run the car up to temp and let it starve, then wrap the line/ filter to carb with a ziplock bag of ice and see if i get fuel suddenly.
heres some thing i was reading about the other day - rigging up air duct for the snorkel, kind of cold air intake style. dude said he knocked off 25 degrees engine temp by this alone. makes sense to me as right now the snorkel is just sitting there in the smack middle of all the engine compartment heat.
anyone here ever try that?
if that doesnt work, and removing the glass inline filter doesnt work, im looking at taking a 3 nipple fuel filter from a cordoba and making a return vapor line. i dont want to do that if i dont have to, but i cant sit in traffic like it is right now. as soon as my engine temp goes 190* you can watch the gas go away in the filter.
i do have everything running uphill so the vapor should go upwards, no drip loops or low spots or places vapor could collect.
- saylor
heres some thing i was reading about the other day - rigging up air duct for the snorkel, kind of cold air intake style. dude said he knocked off 25 degrees engine temp by this alone. makes sense to me as right now the snorkel is just sitting there in the smack middle of all the engine compartment heat.
anyone here ever try that?
if that doesnt work, and removing the glass inline filter doesnt work, im looking at taking a 3 nipple fuel filter from a cordoba and making a return vapor line. i dont want to do that if i dont have to, but i cant sit in traffic like it is right now. as soon as my engine temp goes 190* you can watch the gas go away in the filter.
i do have everything running uphill so the vapor should go upwards, no drip loops or low spots or places vapor could collect.
- saylor
68plymouth383
Senior Member
Are you running a clear filter? Does it fill all the way full when engine is running? I had a problem with my car the filter would fill half way and had bubbles in it. I pressurized the fuel system with air and found out the fuel line at the tank was bad and bleeding pressure off. After replacing it no more problems.
65sporty
Old Man with a Hat
sure sounds like vapor lock, is the fuel line away from exhaust?
saylor
Senior Member
ill try to save yall 8 pages of back reading <--
car died when hot.
changed tank sending unit
changed all rubber tubing connectors - tank, pass. frame rail, frame-to-pump
changed mechanical pump
changed fp pushrod
changed to mr G elec fuel pump - removed mech pump w/ block off plate
still insisted on having glass filter in engine compartment. its out as soon as I get to the store tonight or tomorrow - im going to run steel line from frame to carb and if I put a filter inline it will be an all metal one. there is a filter already between tank and elec pump so I may skip a 2nd filter.
my guess is that the glass filter is getting so hot the gas vaporizes/boils in there and builds enough pressure to stop the liquid gas flow. total guess. open to suggestions.
the line routing is generally in the stock locations, skipping the mechanical FP location and just continuing up behind the alternator - that is currently rubber hose and will be metal tubing with no glass filter inline by the weekend.
car runs like scalded ape *** until 190*.
car died when hot.
changed tank sending unit
changed all rubber tubing connectors - tank, pass. frame rail, frame-to-pump
changed mechanical pump
changed fp pushrod
changed to mr G elec fuel pump - removed mech pump w/ block off plate
still insisted on having glass filter in engine compartment. its out as soon as I get to the store tonight or tomorrow - im going to run steel line from frame to carb and if I put a filter inline it will be an all metal one. there is a filter already between tank and elec pump so I may skip a 2nd filter.
my guess is that the glass filter is getting so hot the gas vaporizes/boils in there and builds enough pressure to stop the liquid gas flow. total guess. open to suggestions.
the line routing is generally in the stock locations, skipping the mechanical FP location and just continuing up behind the alternator - that is currently rubber hose and will be metal tubing with no glass filter inline by the weekend.
car runs like scalded ape *** until 190*.
Was having the same problem on my '76 T&C. Did not really make sense as it has a Thermoquad and the phenolic body is supposed to keep the fuel cool enough to fight vapor lock. Changed the fuel pump no change. Noticed that original owner had wrapped the fuel line from the fuel pump to carb with some of the old fire retardant material like old fire suits, lab pads and heat retardant gloves are made of. I rewrapped and still same issue. Decided to open the carb as it needed a rebuild anyway and got a surprise. Under the main jets in the phenolic body is a small fuel bowel/passage it had got hot, cracked and melted to the lower throttle plate. It is on the drivers side nearest the heat crossover. it was causing a vacuum leak and draining the fuel bowl when it was stopped.
You can also try the old clothes pins on the fuel line on either side of the filter. Seems to dissipate heat like fins on a motorcycle head.
You can also try the old clothes pins on the fuel line on either side of the filter. Seems to dissipate heat like fins on a motorcycle head.
View attachment 29246
Here is a picture of the base plate with the broken part of the jet bowl melted in to it , between the Left primary and secondary butterfly's
Here is a picture of the base plate with the broken part of the jet bowl melted in to it , between the Left primary and secondary butterfly's
saylor
Senior Member
damn glad you mentioned that. I have a new carb too, I forgot to list it ^^ above. I have a summit rebuilt uremco 5-599 2bbl stock replacement. the 1st one I got was not rebuilt correctly and wouldn't let me set idle. the 2nd one they sent me worked out of the box and its on the car now. id take it apart and look except it runs fine from cold motor to 189*.
metal tubing and clothespins are in my future
metal tubing and clothespins are in my future
