1967 Plymouth Fury III 318

[68PK21 440.6bbl]

Your freeze plug problem is most likely due to who installed them 'Dry'. I used the Permatex red super tacky gasket adhesive, the kind that comes in a small can with a brush (or little sponge) attached to the cap, or the brown 3M glue adhesive that is super duper strong and gasoline impervious. Don't be shy with the sealant on the freeze plug and the block, goop them up good and if your worried about the excess outside the plug, just trim it off when it fully dries.

(edit) your freeze plugs could be punched it just a tad further, just so you can see about a 1/16th of a inch of the block bore hole. Look at close up of original pictures of a factory installed block and you can see the plug is just a little further in. I'll see if I have any old pictures of what I mean.

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[68PK21 440.6bbl]

Polling the people. Still have this slow drip. Fresh rebuild. Do I proceed with my first fire just to yank it later or do I take it back out now?

View attachment 433029 View attachment 433030

I really can't quite see a oil drip other than the lower part of the oil pan gasket seal. Now if this is a leak from the 80psi oil prime as I take it you haven't had the engine fully up and running? Rear main seal on these old engines can be problematic. I remember the old original seal that were white rope type material the tip/instructions were to soak the halves in engine oil before installation. This is also a aid when you replace the seal with the engine in car as it helps the rope slide into the channel. The later black colored (graphite?) and even rubber half type seals don't need any soak just a pre-lube with oil or grease. Also gooping the corners and round oil pan rubber gasket with sealer is important (your choice) ie not dry assembly. Both front & rear.

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[68PK21 440.6bbl]

Then I removed the distributor.

I took a picture of how the oil pump drive gear was oriented prior to removal. I inserted the 5/16 hex rod and spun with the drill. I was reading just under 80 psi. I replaced the oil pump drive gear in the same orientation as it was prior to removal. Replaced the distributor with the rotor pointed in the same direction, towards #1 cylinder.

When I attempted to start the engine, I cranked it 4 times with no fire. On the 5th crank there was a LARGE backfire that sounded like a shotgun blast.

I think there may be one of two issues.
#1 I am using MSD wires and a flame thrower coil. The rubber boot on the coil wire does not go onto the flame thrower coil easily. It seems as though the outer housing is too thick for the rubber boot. So maybe the coil wire isn't' fully connecting and I'm not getting spark.
OR
#2 My rotor is off 180 degrees. In my quick research I have read that a large backfire can mean it is firing on the exhaust stroke rather than the compression stroke.

"replaced the oil pump drive gear in the same orientation as it was prior to removal" Was this engine ever run up as in was the cam broken in?
Maybe you are 1 tooth off right from the git-go on the gear, refer to the Factory Service Manual it is your friend and best resource.

Your gear in proper orientation to FSM.

Factory Service Manual for 318/340 block:

Also your picture shows a awful lot of 'Carbon Crud' on the top of the drive gear IMO. It should be not shiny but of a lighter color as in bare metal. How well did your re-builder clean this old engine? Also I just now realized this is not the original 1967 engine but some 'Magnum' engine? So all that I posted from the FSM for 67/68 maybe moot.

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[Furyus67]

Update: Second Attempt

I do believe I had my timing 180 degrees off. I took the #1 spark plug out and put my thumb over the hole and felt it blowing out. When I reached TDC on that stroke the rotor was pointed backwards. So I pulled up the distributor and spun the rotor around.

I looked at a picture of the firing order and how each wire should be run to the plugs. Checked out.

This time when cranking, it seemed like every time I would let off the key, it would burp. Like it wanted to start when I would let off the key.

I guess I'll give a run down of everything:
5.2 magnum with stock rebuild.
Original distributor with pertronix
Flame thrower coil
MSD StreetFire Ignition Wires
Autolite Cooper Spark Plug 3924
I bypassed my ballast resistor with a straight thru wire.

I don't know what else might help diagnose.

Here are two videos:

 

[Kram Edyorloh]

Mate, has this car still got a points distributor or electronic?

 

[Furyus67]

Mate, has this car still got a points distributor or electronic?

Electronic.
Pertronix.

 

[Kram Edyorloh]

If you have the following in order....and I dont know this being 7000miles away...
Fuel at the carb
Crank set at TDC on the crank balancer.... both valves shut on #1 cyl
Rotor arm in line with #1 contact on the dist cap and all plug leads correctly sequenced (forget the *8 BTDC crap for the moment, that comes later)

If that lot is in order, run a wire straight from the POS side of the coil to the POS Batt terminal, bolt in on the coil end but get someone to touch it on the POS Batt terminal, try start it, IF it runs, take the wire off the batt and see if it keeps running...let me know what happens...if anything. Good luck.
Its only a suggestion mate but I think i may be seeing something here.

 

[Furyus67]

If you have the following in order....and I dont know this being 7000miles away...
Fuel at the carb
Crank set at TDC on the crank balancer.... both valves shut on #1 cyl
Rotor arm in line with #1 contact on the dist cap and all plug leads correctly sequenced (forget the *8 BTDC crap for the moment, that comes later)

If that lot is in order, run a wire straight from the POS side of the coil to the POS Batt terminal, bolt in on the coil end but get someone to touch it on the POS Batt terminal, try start it, IF it runs, take the wire off the batt and see if it keeps running...let me know what happens...if anything. Good luck.
Its only a suggestion mate but I think i may be seeing something here.

I'll try it. Are you thinking maybe I'm not getting a full 12v to the coil? I've heard if you aren't getting a full 12 with a pertronix it won't start.

 

[Furyus67]

The Saga Continues...

So I tried a few more things with the Pertronix Ignition. Charged my battery. Ensured it was over 12v, but for some reason I could only get 11.x at the coil. Wouldn't start. It would only burp like it wanted to start every time I let off the key from cranking.

I went and got a new points set, condenser, and ballast resistor. Got a feeler gauge and set the point to .020. Dropped in the distributor. Hooked up the battery and cranked. I barely touched the key and WHAP! Got the first start!!!



That was about the only highlight. I only ended up running it for a total time of about 10 minutes. It appears the head or intake manifold is leaking (aside from the video my oil is really foamy and seems like it has been mixed with coolant).



Also, my transmission is leaking fluid as fast as you can pour it in it seems like. It's leaking out of the bottom of the bellhousing where the dust shield is. The transmission was supposed to have all new seals put in. I don't know what's happening.

1 step forward and 8 steps backwards.

 

[Furyus67]

I'm thinking maybe the intake manifold wasn't sealed correctly. I did have the heads milled flat. Maybe the builder didn't use any kind of gasket maker or RTV in the corners or near the water jackets and it's leaking...

 

[68PK21 440.6bbl]

I did have the heads milled flat.

If your machinist milled the heads and was heavy handed you need to mill the intake surface. This is a well known fact and I have yet to see it mentioned here in this forum yet. Check the factory service manual as there is a formula as to how much you need to take off. This is probably why you have this leak and could have a vacuum leak in the intake ports. Or it could just be a simple answer as that the person that put the engine together didn't goop the corners. <smh>

 

[tbm3fan]

If your machinist milled the heads and was heavy handed you need to mill the intake surface. This is a well known fact and I have yet to see it mentioned here in this forum yet. Check the factory service manual as there is a formula as to how much you need to take off. This is probably why you have this leak and could have a vacuum leak in the intake ports. Or it could just be a simple answer as that the person that put the engine together didn't goop the corners. <smh>

Ugh, which is why I assemble my engines after the machining even though my machinist I have known since 1988. He can install the pistons and crank, after balancing, and then I take it form there which he prefers. He does a lot of race engines and those guys know how to assemble their engines and that way he can keep moving.

 

[RGORHAM29]

If your machinist milled the heads and was heavy handed you need to mill the intake surface. This is a well known fact and I have yet to see it mentioned here in this forum yet. Check the factory service manual as there is a formula as to how much you need to take off. This is probably why you have this leak and could have a vacuum leak in the intake ports. Or it could just be a simple answer as that the person that put the engine together didn't goop the corners. <smh>

Bummer Josh....even though I haven’t tackled my engine yet....I know how frustrated I would be if I had to disassemble the motor too....but I am told it is not uncommon. Sounds like the builder didn’t test it on an engine stand first (some places will do that but you pay extra). From looks of it a few things come to mind....each require some disassembly. You could call your engine builder to see if he will fix it....but if I recall he was 80-ish and may not be able to correct this at this time. So - if doing this yourself, dad friends ....buy some beer and pizza, do some research, set aside some time....and be methodical.

1. Disassemble top end and check for flatness of the block and heads. Not sure what you have for gaskets but you may need another set. Inspect current gaskets - cork vs rubber? Signs of damage? It will tell a story.
2. Did he use sealant (RTV)? Was it a thin coat evenly spread? Should be if used. Was it missing at the corners the valley pan and top of timing chain cover, etc? That could be your leak.
3. double check to make sure everything was torqued correctly and in the correct sequence.

Good luck.

 

[RGORHAM29]

By the way - your car looks great in the videos. You are doing a great job bringing this back to a new life.

 

[65sporty]

I just got caught up on this thread. Some of the leaks can be fixed in the car, but it may be easier to pull it and fix all of them at once. Trans leak from the bellhousing is probably the front pump seal, so either pull the trans or pull the engine

 

[Furyus67]

Bummer Josh....even though I haven’t tackled my engine yet....I know how frustrated I would be if I had to disassemble the motor too....but I am told it is not uncommon. Sounds like the builder didn’t test it on an engine stand first (some places will do that but you pay extra). From looks of it a few things come to mind....each require some disassembly. You could call your engine builder to see if he will fix it....but if I recall he was 80-ish and may not be able to correct this at this time. So - if doing this yourself, dad friends ....buy some beer and pizza, do some research, set aside some time....and be methodical.

1. Disassemble top end and check for flatness of the block and heads. Not sure what you have for gaskets but you may need another set. Inspect current gaskets - cork vs rubber? Signs of damage? It will tell a story.
2. Did he use sealant (RTV)? Was it a thin coat evenly spread? Should be if used. Was it missing at the corners the valley pan and top of timing chain cover, etc? That could be your leak.
3. double check to make sure everything was torqued correctly and in the correct sequence.

Good luck.

I think my issue is going to be the intake manifold gaskets. I purchased the the ENGINETECH RMCR318DP rebuild/gasket kit from RockAuto when this project started. Looking back now at the gaskets included in the kit....they look like junk now compared to the fel-pro gaskets everyone recommends. I'm definitely learning from mistakes. But hey, that's how it goes.

I keep telling my wife, "the engine rebuild of my next project will be way better, done right the first time, and cheaper due to less mistakes." That is promptly followed by, "no more projects for a while!!" haha.

The plan is to pull the manifold this weekend (if time allows) and see what's going on.

 

[Furyus67]

I just got caught up on this thread. Some of the leaks can be fixed in the car, but it may be easier to pull it and fix all of them at once. Trans leak from the bellhousing is probably the front pump seal, so either pull the trans or pull the engine

Definitely going to have to pull the transmission. It's aggravating because the transmission didn't leak like that before I took it out of service for the engine rebuild. While I had it out I figured I'd have all the seals replaced. Then when I fire it up, it's in worse condition than it was before I took it out.

 

[65sporty]

You have the converter seated all the way didn't you?

 

[Furyus67]

You have the converter seated all the way didn't you?

I believe so.

 

[Furyus67]

Took the transmission back out today. I believe my front seal is leaking. Had fluid coming out when I removed the torque converter. I wiped everything clean and there still seemed to be a slow leak.

Next I’ll be working to fix the coolant leak issue. Drained the oil and this is what I got