70 Dodge C body research help please

[69CoronetRT]

How much effort do you think Galen had to put into those books? I'm sure quite a lot and I respect him for that. He states right in the books that the info is as accurate as possible with the info known at the moment and with the help of several others that he credits. Does he have particular interest in C-bodies and Imps? Probably not but neither did most everyone else in the hobby at the time either. How much difference would it make if the production numbers in his books turned out to be wrong? Who knows? Whose fault would it be if they were wrong? His or is he just the messenger??

The messenger and one I do give great credit. Knowing what little I know, it took one hell of an effort to compile and publish the books. He may have faults and quirks, but no one can fault him for compiling the white books. Would it be great if information he did not have surfaced and reported? Certainly.

 

[TX9]

Faults and Quirks?! That FRAUD actually STOLE my fee to get in his so called Registry for my '70 R/T Challenger Vert- NEVER GOT REFUND OR REPORT

 

[detmatt]

Faults and Quirks?! That FRAUD actually STOLE my fee to get in his so called Registry for my '70 R/T Challenger Vert- NEVER GOT REFUND OR REPORT

I'd keep after him on it.

 

[polara71]

I'd keep after him on it.

 

[commando1]

Galen went through a very rough period caring for his wife during her terminal illness.

 

[ceebuddy]

I think Galen Govier is a great guy, although my contact with him was little so far. Not sure, but I think he originally is a muscle car guy with not too much interest in C-bodies. There were some flaws concerning C-bodies that I had noticed in a previous edition of the white book (I think it was the fourth edition or so) and I let him know and he thanked me and corrected them in the following edition. Plus nobody is perfect, so he might not be the supreme and ultimate source of knowledge when it comes to C-bodies. This is not meant to put him down in any way, his books have helped me and so many other enthusiasts in many ways and have finally shed light on things previously unclear.

I found information on the "DE" VIN's of the Polara Special in the Standard Catalog of Chrysler. As far as production figures go they state that all 1970 Polara figures are mingled into one per body style. I will have to look it up again tonight.

 

[polara71]

I found information on the "DE" VIN's of the Polara Special in the Standard Catalog of Chrysler. As far as production figures go they state that all 1970 Polara figures are mingled into one per body style. I will have to look it up again tonight.

Bingo ..... I was thinking about this yesterday and knowing the numbers/ information must be available since it's in that publication and that was printed 25 years ago.

 

[kmccabe56]

Some new information has surfaced and we're trying to rectify some factory shipment numbers. The info doesn't balance.

Send me what you've got and I'll have a look at it.

Was there a 70 Dodge spring special, or a special release some other time of the year, that may have been VINned differently on the window sticker or dealer invoice?

Yes, discussed elsewhere in this thread.

For example, and example only......was there a Polara 318 Special with a low trim option package that carried a PE VIN on the window sticker or invoice?

Not PE but DE

Was there a higher trim or Special Monaco with a Deluxe package released some time?

Can't keep all this stuff in my head. I'll have to check.

The info we're seeking could have even been related to a station wagon package/special release.

I don't recall one, but that doesn't mean squat. I can't remember what I ate yesterday.

It's possible it was a special option package on a specific model.

I'm pretty sure (again I have to check) that there were several.

We don't know what it was that could account for the discrepancy.

There are more possibile reasons than you could shake a stick at.

We just know the numbers don't balance indicating shipments of cars not accounted for by the expected VINs.

Not sure I understand what you're referring to by "expected" vins.

There was something else shipped.

Export cars for one.

Part two: has anyone ever seen credible numbers for Canada sold Monaco 500 cars?

Yep, got that too.

Haven't been around all that much simply because I have too many demands on my time and not enough hours or energy to keep up. If you want to send me what you've got, and have some "SPECIFIC" questions to ask, I'll put it in my work pile and get to it. Eventually.

 

[69CoronetRT]

Thanks for the reply. It appears the Polara Special was the info needed. PE was a typo I didn't correct.

 

[ceebuddy]

This is the info from the Standard Catalog of Chrysler:

 

[polara71]

Thank you. That saved me the trouble of digging my book out tonight and taking the photos

 

[mr. fix it]

There was Polara AAR....

 

[polara71]

That one was a rusty original car before the mods

 

[detmatt]

Years ago that green one was getting torn apart here on a regular basis.

 

[kmccabe56]

This is the info from the Standard Catalog of Chrysler:

As much as you guys dislike GG's info, the Standard Catalog of Chrysler makes me cringe far, far more. The errors, omissions and invalid inferences in that book, in my opinion, make suited only to be turned into a yule log. Look at the pictures. Ignore all of the text.

Polara wagon totals can be gleaned from the O&A reports. Since none were exported, the quantities should be pretty close to 100% correct.

SCC is correct in that there is no production info on DE cars for 1970. However, there is O&A info.

DE cars were called Polara Special. They appear to be unique to the US market. There is no mention of them in the Cdn O&A.

From the US O&A, it lists DE41 132/5792, (6&8) DE45 530 DE46 453. All wagons were V8.

The rarest D branded C body is a Polara Custom 2dr hdtp . With a /6. All sold in Canada. There were 17. ONE had a 3 speed on the tree, was a two tone (no vinyl roof) and was relatively well equipped including HD suspension.

My 1970 US O&A report is almost indecipherable. One day when I have bags of uninterrupted time, I will attempt to transcribe it onto an excel spreadsheet. But I can see this little "project" taking weeks to accomplish. Right now I have minutes to work on projects, so this will not happen any time soon.

Speaking of production info, I did find out that as far as export cars go, there were a handful of RHD sedans, as well as LHD KD and KDUB cars.

 

[69CoronetRT]

Thank you. That is very helpful.

Does the O$A report break them out as a separate VIN or by the A71 option code?

 

[sdweatherman]

Here is what I have on the 70 Dodge C Bodies - thanks to Ola Nilsson for sharing this with me. This report details additional US shipments for the month of September, and then total model year units shipped to US by the end of September. From those two numbers, you can subtract and get the number of units shipped by the end of August (which is what is on the normal O&A reports).

Please let me know if these numbers jive with what you guys are digging up.

Polara Special / Thru Aug / Sept / Total Thru Sept
DE41 4Dr Sed / 5,919 / 58 / 5,977
DE45 2 seat Wag / 530 / 0 / 530
DE46 3 seat Wag / 453 / 1 / 454

Polara / Thru Aug / Sept / Total Thru Sept
DL23 2Dr HT / 11,438 / 9 / 11,447
DL27 Conv / 695 / 1 / 696
DL41 4Dr Sed / 14,181 / 3 / 14,185
DL43 4Dr HT / 15,713 / 1 / 15,714
DL45 2 seat Wag / 3,057 / 0 / 3,057
DL46 3 seat Wag / 3,521 / 0 / 3,521

Polara Custom / Thru Aug / Sept / Total Thru Sept
DM23 2Dr HT / 3,743 / 3 / 3,746
DM41 4Dr Sed / 4,024 / 29 / 4,053
DM43 4Dr HT / 3,411 / 8 / 3,419

Monaco / Thru Aug / Sept / Total Thru Sept
DH23 2Dr HT / 3,307 / 15 / 3,322
DH41 4Dr Sedan / 4,639 / 15 / 4,654
DH43 4Dr HT / 10,834 / 15 / 10,849
DH45 2 seat Wag / 2,202 / 2 / 2,204
DH46 3 seat Wag / 3,207 / 2 / 3,209

Police / Thru Aug / Sept / Total Thru Sept
DK41 4Dr Sed / 1,717 / 15 / 1,732

Taxi / Thru Aug / Sept / Total Thru Sept
DT41 4Dr Sed / 145 / 0 / 145

 

[sdweatherman]

Ok, the spacing on the above numbers didn't turn out well - hard to read. Here is a picture of the notebook page I worked up - easier to read. Again, let me know if these numbers jive with what you guys have on these cars.

 

[Fratzog]

Thanks for all the data but I'm still unclear why there is a difference between the 2 numbers. Isn't September the end of the model year and shouldn't the 2 numbers be the same?

 

[sdweatherman]

Someone correct me if I am wrong - but I think I have this semi-sorted out. The end of the production year - or when Chrysler was winding down current model year production usually occurred mid to late July. Usually around the last week of July, they were getting the assembly lines set up for the next model year - and typically they started putting together the first run of new cars around the 1st of August.

A lot of the Mopar "production" numbers that are out there come from the Options and Accessories reports that Chrysler typically printed out at the end of August. That gave Chrysler about a month to get the current model year cars shipped out to dealerships.

So - if Chrysler was successful in getting these cars "shipped" off of the Assembly Plant lots and to dealerships by the end of August, then the "production" numbers on the August 31st run of the Options and Accessories reports should be pretty good numbers. Here is the key I believe - if there were any cars that had not left the Assembly plant lots before the final August O&A reports were compiled - those cars were not counted as being "shipped". That is the key thing to remember on these O&A reports that get referenced to for "production" numbers. They actually only tell us how many units were "shipped" for that model year.

Now in the case of the 1970 model year - it looks like Chrysler didn't quite get all their cars shipped out before the end of August. There were a few stragglers that were shipped out to dealerships during the month of September. It might have been a slow sales year - and it just took them an extra month to clean out the lots.

I hope this is just a little clearer than mud. Scott.