For Sale 70 Monaco 500 FK5

[mdh157]

Just read a bunch of this thread. It is a shame but like someone said, it is his car. Too bad it was on the side of the country that kept many of us away.

On the flip side, it is like any other big body car from any of the big 4 (adding AMC): not as much interest in the bigger cars but they have the drivetrains the pony guys want so they are dismantled so they can bring a POS out of the junkyard and put a big block in it. We all know you can buy pretty much any yr/color/drivetrain Goat, Stang, Cutlass or AMX you want. They are all over the place.

 

[brougham brummel]

Shouldn,t that be goodie bags?B.B

 

[dh23t]

I went to take a leak. Did I miss anything?

Possibly the toilet?

 

[cantflip]

Possibly the toilet?

I'm pretty sure there have been no dribbles on the floor since I was there last...

 

[dh23t]

Alternatively, if this Monaco at issue had been this color to begin with, and which is also well loaded with options (and not the dreaded Auto Temp 1 system), I believe it would have had a much better chance of being snapped up. The example below was owned by Tim on this site until recently, when it was sold to a new owner here in the good old USA:

View attachment 234646

Just pure class................................[/QUOTE]

Steve, that was not my car. I never had those wheels on my car for any length of time, and definitely not in a location like that. I didn't like those wheels on my car, and took them off. My car spent most of its time in the garage after the refresh, and that is why I sold it. I am having much more fun in my 300 convertible. I actually use it. In one year I have put on half of the miles I put on the monaco in almost 10.

 

[saforwardlook]

Alternatively, if this Monaco at issue had been this color to begin with, and which is also well loaded with options (and not the dreaded Auto Temp 1 system), I believe it would have had a much better chance of being snapped up. The example below was owned by Tim on this site until recently, when it was sold to a new owner here in the good old USA:

View attachment 234646

Just pure class................................

Steve, that was not my car. I never had those wheels on my car for any length of time, and definitely not in a location like that. I didn't like those wheels on my car, and took them off. My car spent most of its time in the garage after the refresh, and that is why I sold it. I am having much more fun in my 300 convertible. I actually use it. In one year I have put on half of the miles I put on the monaco in almost 10.[/QUOTE]

Thanks for the correction Tim. Did your car have the same paint color as the one in the photo above? When I learned of the sale of the Monaco in the photo above, the seller said the guy he bought it from was Tim, so I assumed it must be you. My mistake.

 

[brougham brummel]

Such intense opinions about this one car.What if it been a whole collection that was pieced out.This site would crash.Heh.B.B

 

[dh23t]

Steve, that was not my car. I never had those wheels on my car for any length of time, and definitely not in a location like that. I didn't like those wheels on my car, and took them off. My car spent most of its time in the garage after the refresh, and that is why I sold it. I am having much more fun in my 300 convertible. I actually use it. In one year I have put on half of the miles I put on the monaco in almost 10.

Thanks for the correction Tim. Did your car have the same paint color as the one in the photo above? When I learned of the sale of the Monaco in the photo above, the seller said the guy he bought it from was Tim, so I assumed it must be you. My mistake.[/QUOTE]

The car you attached the photo of was this one
Weekend Edition – A 1970 Dodge Monaco Coupe found on eBay

Which is definitely not my old car. Mine had power windows, tilt with rimblow, buckets with console, and the exhaust pipes were not protruding like that. There were a few A4 monaco 500s around at one point. In 2010 , I actually bought another a4 with gator grain top, console car but with a 383 HP. I ended up not taking delivery of the car due to circumstances beyond my control.
I was actually offered the infamous burnt orange car on this thread in about 2009, for 1500, but passed on it. I had one already at that point, and didn't know why i would need a second one.

 

[saforwardlook]

Thanks for the correction Tim. Did your car have the same paint color as the one in the photo above? When I learned of the sale of the Monaco in the photo above, the seller said the guy he bought it from was Tim, so I assumed it must be you. My mistake.

The car you attached the photo of was this one
Weekend Edition – A 1970 Dodge Monaco Coupe found on eBay

Which is definitely not my old car. Mine had power windows, tilt with rimblow, buckets with console, and the exhaust pipes were not protruding like that. There were a few A4 monaco 500s around at one point. In 2010 , I actually bought another a4 with gator grain top, console car but with a 383 HP. I ended up not taking delivery of the car due to circumstances beyond my control.
I was actually offered the infamous burnt orange car on this thread in about 2009, for 1500, but passed on it. I had one already at that point, and didn't know why i would need a second one.[/QUOTE]

So there must have been two Tims that owned A4 1970 Dodge Monacos in the recent past. What a small world! I recalled yours was well optioned but I didn't know what options the car in the photo I showed had. It was just an image of one that had your color that I incorrectly concluded must have been yours. And I personally don't like the wider than stock white walls or as you said, the extended tailpipe tips on that one above either. Thanks for the clarification.

 

[brougham brummel]

One of my Keith Martin magazines had a 2 door polara earlier this year that went for over 4000.00. Which i think is encouraging.It needed some work but looked solid from a distance.A fusey era model year.Think it was a 69.B.B

 

[fury fan]

When I talked with him he claimed one of the factors that made him decide to divest himself of this car was that it had significant rust and other body damage/poor repairs that were not that obvious until he took it all apart.

I'm not a pro bodyman, but I've done enough of it, and have had old cars (at anywhere from qty 2 to 9 at a time), over the last 25 years.
So qualified to say this, perhaps even moreso because I'm not 'a pro':

Any rust so significant that the car needed parted out, but could only be found by totally disassembling the car, is a BS story.
You can spend an afternoon, maybe a full a day, with a car on a lift, and you go up, down, all around.
The hardest part is the cowl -- so you crawl under the dash while flooding the cowl with a hose and look for water leaks.
And who can do 'poor quality' repairs that a 30-year 'pro' cannot find easily?
If you couldn't see certain rust until total disassembly, then it's not so major, or so widespread, that it can't be fixed. Or you leave the car alone and make your decision right there.

Somebody else said it - the guy found out it wasn't going to be quick and easy. He chose a poor path, and bailing out looked like the easiest way out.


Mr Saforwardlook -
I remember some time back you jumped on me because I felt a particular beat-up and sun-baked red 300 2dr was too far gone to be worth saving.
You were highly critical of me, specifically for 'spouting off, as I frequently do, when people don't agree with my opinions'. (paraphrasing)
Because your opinion on that car was the right opinion, and my opinion was wrong, and you presumably didn't like that I continued to explain my opinion.

But it looks to me like you were doing that same thing here, repeatedly spouting about this guy, trying to explain things, because other people didn't agree with you.

 

[saforwardlook]

I'm not a pro bodyman, but I've done enough of it, and have had old cars (at anywhere from qty 2 to 9 at a time), over the last 25 years.
So qualified to say this, perhaps even moreso because I'm not 'a pro':

Any rust so significant that the car needed parted out, but could only be found by totally disassembling the car, is a BS story.
You can spend an afternoon, maybe a full a day, with a car on a lift, and you go up, down, all around.
The hardest part is the cowl -- so you crawl under the dash while flooding the cowl with a hose and look for water leaks.
And who can do 'poor quality' repairs that a 30-year 'pro' cannot find easily?
If you couldn't see certain rust until total disassembly, then it's not so major, or so widespread, that it can't be fixed. Or you leave the car alone and make your decision right there.

Somebody else said it - the guy found out it wasn't going to be quick and easy. He chose a poor path, and bailing out looked like the easiest way out.


Mr Saforwardlook -
I remember some time back you jumped on me because I felt a particular beat-up and sun-baked red 300 2dr was too far gone to be worth saving.
You were highly critical of me, specifically for 'spouting off, as I frequently do, when people don't agree with my opinions'. (paraphrasing)
Because your opinion on that car was the right opinion, and my opinion was wrong, and you presumably didn't like that I continued to explain my opinion.

But it looks to me like you were doing that same thing here, repeatedly spouting about this guy, trying to explain things, because other people didn't agree with you.

And you said you don't hold grudges . You seem to have a problem with someone disagreeing with you it seems to me. People don't always agree. It is just a normal part of life and should not to be intepreted as an attack of some sort.

I employ a pro body guy and you should come and visit when he finds an unexpected extent of rust, expecially on A and B bodies that wasn't all that apparent from the look of the car on the outside and a pretty good going over on the parts of the inside that you can see. Guys send him cars to repair and want a quote on what it will cost to fix it. And when he sees evidence of rust and finds that it is more pervasive than was expected until digging into things further, they back out of the project completely when the totals come in.

And you said above, "Any rust so significant that the car needed parted out, but could only be found by totally disassembling the car, is a BS story." That is not what happened, and incorrectly states what did, so maybe you should go back and read the whole story more slowly, as he did try to sell it with the resources/time he felt he had available as a complete vehicle that was worth restoring if you love these cars, but no one wanted to do that he heard from with a reasonable offer probably because it was too disassembled (he did that to paint it) - and he took a $3500 loss to try and make that happen. He didn't have the time to do that work because of all the reasons I stated and he admitted he did what he did because he couldn't make any money completing it himself and still finish the work in his shop for paying customers who he has to satisfy above all else. He never said the car needed to be parted out but rather tried to prevent it!

Regarding the red car, you were more right than I was, as it rusted from the inside out from leaves that had collected on the floors and water had soaked the carpets rusting out the floors completely and none of this was disclosed and the seller flat-out lied when I asked him about rust. From the outside, which he did show, it didn't look that bad and it wasn't. And the trunk floor was actually better than I expected. The rust was due to water collection, not salt. The guy selling the car also didn't reveal that part of the firewall was cut out. So if that helps calm you down, maybe you can relax a bit in the future. You said I wrongly accused you of "spouting off" but that is your paraphrasing as you admit and you also said you presume I said what I did because I continued to disagree with you. That isn't correct either. I said what I did because you get so emotional when someone disagrees with you as I have observed in previous posts and you apparently are showing in this post as well by misstating what happend because you didn't read it thoroughly.

You can call this guy Lee a liar if you have to, but nothing I heard from him to me at least was misleading and he is a pro body guy that has done this work for 30 years. Dishonest body guys don't usually have 30 years of loyal customers. I went down there and saw a lot in person, and although I didn't see the shell since it was in a friend's back yard, I at least have some insight to his character that you do not have. I do not easily, publically on the internet, call someone a liar unless I know more than you do about them. You say I was "spouting about this guy" but that also is incorrect about what I stated, but rather I was just trying to explain why things happened the way they did from his perspective and the realities I saw before me, not to defend him where he made decisions in the beginning I would not have made as I stated several times now.


Best wishes.

 

[detmatt]

Here’s what’s killing me about this thread. The last thing I want to read about is why this douchebag did what he did to this car in seemingly a 2 week period, it’s irrelevant and yet I feel like I had to read about it 15 times. He took an amazing car right out of circulation through his own ignorant and shortsighted decision making. His behavior at least in this situation is borderline sociopathic. **** I won’t scrap a pallet full of old cut up wiring harnesses because of what they could mean to our community.

 

[polara71]

Here’s what’s killing me about this thread. The last thing I want to read about is why this douchebag did what he did to this car in seemingly a 2 week period, it’s irrelevant and yet I feel like I had to read about it 15 times. He took an amazing car right out of circulation through his own ignorant and shortsighted decision making. His behavior at least in this situation is borderline sociopathic. **** I won’t scrap a pallet full of old cut up wiring harnesses because of what they could mean to our community.

 

[commando1]

Here’s what’s killing me about this thread. The last thing I want to read about is why this douchebag did what he did to this car in seemingly a 2 week period, it’s irrelevant and yet I feel like I had to read about it 15 times. He took an amazing car right out of circulation through his own ignorant and shortsighted decision making. His behavior at least in this situation is borderline sociopathic. **** I won’t scrap a pallet full of old cut up wiring harnesses because of what they could mean to our community.

Never seen you this upset.

 

[Mr C]

This is a sad product of that Velocity channel/ Gas Monkey/ Graveyard Cars ...you name it mentality that is ruining the hobby (and evidently some damn rare cars). The mentality that if you can't get the investment back, then the car is worthless/ not worth restoring. It fairly seeps from the add.
He was hoping for some 6 figure pay off due to the car's rarity and then discovered the only way out was to sell the parts off to recover his "investment". You see it all the time...68-70 Charger incomplete basket cases for $10 k.
This dude is not a car guy.

 

[detmatt]

Never seen you this upset.

The rate of people making me this upset seems to be increasing.

 

[rapidtrans]

You sound like me at work!
I can’t retire soon enough.

 

[saforwardlook]

I will only say that his car guy interest is in Forward Look cars - that I saw first hand. I also saw a Cuda in his small collection that he is restoring for himself but progress is slow he said due to the need to make money with customers first.

His other perception that led to this is that C body guys are cheap, and while they say how much they want a car to be saved, few will step up to make a purchase, even when it would be a steal, as was this car despite being disassembled if you really like the fuselage Dodges and have any disposable income available at all. Lee listed this Monaco on Facebook, a venue he knows best and targeted the groups he thought would be most interested. He never got one call on the car from that venue in over 5 weeks, he told me. Honestly, I find that perception hard to dispell, since I find I can't sell a good C body here in the states after many years of trying and get my money back in fixing them up to be appreciated by buyers and be satisfied. I refuse to sell junk. C body guys don't have the deep pockets like many of the B and E body guys for example. Our cars that we like best are viewed as "old mens' cars" as opposed to the sporty character of the B and E bodies. The people that like the C bodies as most of us do, are generally older, not into restoring cars much anymore and are living on pensions or more limited resources than those buying B or E bodies. C body guys are generally reliving their past while the B and E body guys are reliving their youth. There is a big difference in draw between the groups.

I always am getting requests from overseas buyers who badly want a B body from 1968 - 1971. I have a few of those, a 1969 Charger RT/SE, a 1971 curious yellow Road Runner, a 1971 Charger R/T and a fully restored 1970 Cuda 440-6 car. I am hounded all the time for me to sell any of the four of them to volumes of potential buyers whether overseas or over here. Such is not the case with the multiple C bodies that I also have that are very desirable. But I do have some interest from the overseas folks in the Cs, but few even ask that live in the states. And I do have a good reputation with folks overseas who are willing to pay for my cars far more than people in the states and I don't even have to advertise them to sell them. Word of mouth takes care of all that.

As I have said many times, I just don't have the time or will to try to sell a C body in the states on Craigslist and put up with all the B.S. or post on Ebay where overseas guys generally won't take a chance on buying off that venue because of the scams and other problems with that option - once a car arrives overseas and it is crap, it becomes a real problem for them, so overseas guys generally will buy only from known sources over here with a good reputation or pay a guy at least $2000 to get on a plane and inspect a car for them with over 300 photos and do test drives and use a coating thickness meter to detect bondo and other poor repairs. And I see a low "take rate" on FCBO on desireable C bodys available despite a lot of interest and back and forth on some of them probably for the reasons stated above on the group of people that generally desire the Cs these days.

And since Matt (or maybe it is his dad) has an E body convertible and some Cs ( Imperial at least, which is not a C technically) I believe, he must have some understanding of what I am talking about.

Sure you can disagree with what I have said, but I really don't care. I have been through the wringer and won't go through it again with guys over here. But there are some guys I know well that want C body cars that are special to them and are well heeled here in the states. These are successful guys that have been here to visit my asylum and I just need to call them up when I am ready to sell, and it is a done deal with no problems.

Talk is cheap.

 

[rapidtrans]

“Opinions vary.” John Dalton.