MrMoparCHP
Old Man with a Hat
No but the text does in adjusting ride height a few pages earlier. It is measured below the ball joint and the lower control arm pivot.
Alan
Lowering question
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No but the text does in adjusting ride height a few pages earlier. It is measured below the ball joint and the lower control arm pivot.
Alan
67Monaco
Old Man with a Hat
bajajoaquin
Senior Member
Yeah, you measure the two heights, and then subtract the larger from the smaller. They designed the procedure so it didn't matter what tires you had.
I don't remember what you said about your ride height in the rear, but if it's stock or close to stock, I'd recommend adjusting the front to factory height and trying it out. Probably align it there. It's super-easy to change the ride height, so you can drive it around for a while and then drop it down an inch or two. It will be easier to know what the compromises are if you have a stock baseline.
I don't remember what you said about your ride height in the rear, but if it's stock or close to stock, I'd recommend adjusting the front to factory height and trying it out. Probably align it there. It's super-easy to change the ride height, so you can drive it around for a while and then drop it down an inch or two. It will be easier to know what the compromises are if you have a stock baseline.
bajajoaquin
Senior Member
Alan,
You're right. I misread the part about the coil mount. And we don't disagree that lowering using the adjuster screws is not an optimal way of doing it.
We do still disagree on some of the other stuff, though. I still don't think you're accounting for the effects of spring preload. It doesn't change the rate, we agree there. However, it does change where in the spring's compression the car sits while static. It makes the ride firmer (higher) or softer (lower). Note I didn't say it changes the spring rate. I'm hypothesizing that you could mitigate this one aspect of lowering the car by going to stiffer springs. I'm not saying it's going to resolve all issues. I think you should lower your car down a couple inches and see how it differs. Or raise it up.
You would find the other thing we disagree about if you were to do that. I don't think the changes in geometry are all that significant at this amount of lowering (2", if I remember an earlier post accurately). I say that because my car sat about 2" low when I got it. It wallowed a lot more than it does now, but it had no issues with bump steer or other weirdness that couldn't be explained by the crappy old tires and wonky alignment numbers.
If you don't want to crank your OP (Other Polara) up or down, let me know when you're in San Diego next, and we can spend a few hours in the afternoon playing with mine. We can even air up and down shocks and see how rake affects it!
I just don't think it's a big deal.
-Jonathan
MrMoparCHP
Old Man with a Hat
These adjusters are no different than lowering blocks in the rear, it just changes the relative location of the wheel to the spring.
Unless you change the degree of twist on the torsion bar you are making no change to the spring, you are limiting the degree of rotation in one direction and incressing the degree of rotation in the other.
I do not see preloading coming into play if you are not changing the loading on the spring.
The hub of the control arm that the torsion bar connect to is floating in the arm, the adjuster bolt leverages against this hub.
Adjusting the bolt just changes the relation of the control arm to the hub of the control arm, at no point are you changing anything with the torsion bar, it is in the same relative position as it was before the adjustment. other than adding weight or removing weight you will observe no change to the bars.
Test this, mark the end of the bar right at the control arm the adjust it, the mark will not move.
Alan
Unless you change the degree of twist on the torsion bar you are making no change to the spring, you are limiting the degree of rotation in one direction and incressing the degree of rotation in the other.
I do not see preloading coming into play if you are not changing the loading on the spring.
The hub of the control arm that the torsion bar connect to is floating in the arm, the adjuster bolt leverages against this hub.
Adjusting the bolt just changes the relation of the control arm to the hub of the control arm, at no point are you changing anything with the torsion bar, it is in the same relative position as it was before the adjustment. other than adding weight or removing weight you will observe no change to the bars.
Test this, mark the end of the bar right at the control arm the adjust it, the mark will not move.
Alan
jippek
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Thanks, this was what I was suspecting, but with my English I did not find that "subtract" from the text
ixie:Even though there is a lot of anti slamming people here, I also plan on eventually slamming my 72 Newport but going the route of air ride which if definitely not cheap. It will set me back around $3000 in parts and doing all the fab work and labour myself on top of that. Sure it is a waste of time value wise because I would never get the money back that I put into it but the parts can always be removed to use on another project and it is also for the personal satisfaction of doing the build myself and having something different. I have seen a C body yet that gets REALLY low like sitting on the body/frame. Everyone that has done air ride has not cut out a tunnel for driveshaft clearance yet. That is the main thing that needs to get done to make the rear really low.
So in the end $3000 in parts and a good 100-150 hours of work. Are people prepared to do this on a C-body That is lucky to bring in $10-15k fully restored? Highly unlikely because modified air ride cars are lucky to bring in 3/4's of a restored price.
So in the end $3000 in parts and a good 100-150 hours of work. Are people prepared to do this on a C-body That is lucky to bring in $10-15k fully restored? Highly unlikely because modified air ride cars are lucky to bring in 3/4's of a restored price.
70bigblockdodge
Old Man with a Hat
Turning the adjuster does not change rate on the bars only height to make them softer or harder you have to change the stiffness or rockwells of the bars or change diameter. Seems like the best way on a c-body would be to modify the lower control arm to raise the ball joint higher thus lowering the control arm and overall height of the car. This may not allow for the amount of understeer that the factory dialed in so that john and joan Q Public don't kill themselves but I think if you added a bigger sway bar that are being offered now a days or something fabbed off a giant suv you could keep the body roll down enough to keep neutral feel in the steering. It will a.lso keep you off the bump stops. Being that it is just stamped steel with a riveted end it should be able to be sectioned and plated? Just my rambling thoughts
commando1
Old Man with a Hat
bajajoaquin
Senior Member
Okay, once again: I have never said it changes the rate. In fact I have said the opposite. I have said that changing the ride height makes the ride harder or softer because of changing preload. Alan laid down a clear description of how the adjuster works. So until I'm willing to take the time to test for myself, I'm not going to argue with him.
However, let's clear up the preload misconception. Let's say you have a 5" bolt, coil spring 5" long with a rate of one pound per inch, and a nut. If you put the spring on the bolt and put the nut on behind it, it will take one pound of pressure to move that spring one inch. If you screw the nut down one inch, it will take two pounds of pressure to move the spring down one inch. In either case, the rate is the same, but in the different circumstances, you have to apply different amounts of pressure to get the first inch of available travel.
Our cars use torsion springs rather than coil springs, but the principle is the same. Spring preload is a good, simple way to adjust ride height where you are not trying to specifically isolate springs and geometry. Like passenger cars or street motorcycles, where this type of adjustment is common.
Alan, an, as I mentioned above, you laid out a clear description of the mechanism. It doesn't feel entirely right to me, but I can't provide a competing description, so I don't have anything to rebut with. Can you help me understand something, though? If the adjuster isn't putting preload on the spring through the finger, how was it that I couldn't get the bars back in unless I rotated the finger down past the set of the bars? I don't know if that made sense.
When i do my tie rods, I'm going to play with the adjusters to get a feel for it more. I'm also going to try to test by measuring how much weight causes how much deflection with the adjuster all the way in, all the way out, and at stock ride height.
bajajoaquin
Senior Member
In some parts of town you can get a tranny for a lot less than $3k if that's what you're into.
It would be a lot more than 2 inch cause I would have it sitting on the ground.
Engine is a strong 440
Brakes are great and just going to be replacing the front discs just cause.
Tranny........ think you jinx me on that. Lost reverse today.
Interior is as mint as a 72 Newport would be with original interior. 64k original miles on the car.
Needs a driver side fender and then some light body work and paint.
Bought the car last June for $900. Think I scored pretty good.
1hotplymouth
New Member
i dropped my 68 new yorker 3 inches by changing to a low profile tire
Alchemi
Member
what size rubber band did you end up with?
Another option is to put some ricer style ground effects spoilers and side skirts on :laughing1:
Although a front dam & belly plate would improve h/way economy and top speed.....
- on a side note there are way too may emoticons to go through lol
commando1
Old Man with a Hat
Twern't me. It's god telling you something.
67Monaco
Old Man with a Hat
Yeah. your transmission needed a rebuild.
440Sled
Well-Known Member
Just lower it......I rolled around on cranked torsions and cut bumpstops for years. No issues after an allignment and it rode smooth. If you're going to be serious have the exhaust re-done and have the pipes tucked up further so they dont drag on everything.
440Sled
Well-Known Member
This ought a piss a few off........I finally read all of this thread. Save your $$$ and headaches and at least think about getting hydro's. With the accumualtors it rides better than air, no compressors kicking on and charge your batteries MAYBE every 4 months. I'm so glad I went with hydros over air. I still have leafs out back with blocks and I've had no issues. That front end and fab work involved will be insane!
http://www.losboulevardosmessageboard.com/showthread.php?4939-1968-Chrysler-New-Yorker
http://www.losboulevardosmessageboard.com/showthread.php?4939-1968-Chrysler-New-Yorker
Just the reverse band. I will spend some weekend and fix it. Not in a hurry to do it. Might just get a used 727 for $200 and use that for now and rebuild my current one.
Haven't lowered yet so it can't be god punishing me lol
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