How's Everyone On Newer Cars?

azblackhemi

Old Man with a Hat
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I know we are really really good at solving problems on our old iron so here's a chance to prove ourselves on the newer stuff. I have an 05 Magnum R/T with the 5.7 Hemi. It runs and drives good but my fuel mileage has been steadily dropping over the 6000 miles I've put on it. In my regular driving it was getting close to 18mpg's but has fallen to just over 15. The only thing I've tried so far is changing the plugs. No improvement there. Like I said it seems to run good with no miss or check engine light. My next idea is to change the plug wires but don't want to just start grasping at straws. The car has 112000 miles on it. I'm also wondering if it could be a plugged cat? Whaadda youse guys think?
 
Not the cat, you would have other problems, low power, a check eng light because something wont be happy if exh can't get out. Besides I think it has more than one cat. Back to basics what is the air filter like? I will think about what else you can ck
 
Chris, you can't think traditionally about how to troubleshoot a computerized engine.
A dim tail light could tell the computer to put the engine into limp-home mode.
You need to pull up the codes. And not the wussey generic codes from your $19.95 Harbor Freight code "reader". I'm talking about the codes that can only be pulled by a code reader that has the factory specific codes that are not released to the public.
Here's the rub that pisses me off no end. You go to the dealer, the only place that has these machines capable if pulling factory codes and they tuck ut up you butt with a mandatory "Diagnostic Service Charge - 1 Hr." (read: we have you by the balls with another up charge).

Fuggit. Change the Cats.
 
I will check the cat's temperature. Damn why do I always have a dead car on my lift when I need it.
 
The key iz to have wrenchin' friendz at the dealership that will walk out back and plug your ride in and skin that cat for ah case of beer at Christmas time any time you need it skinned. It ain't rocket science, it'z called networking the old way, Jer
 
Have you considered that maybe it could be fuel delivery, have you replaced the fuel filter? Your fuel pressure, at the fuel rail should be 59psi +/- 5psi with the ignition on engine not running. I could cut and paste the whole fuel delivery test procedure on here from All Data, but it is lengthy.
 
My wife's trailblazer has a bad cat, cat% efficiency check engine light is on, one thing I learned is if the downstream O2 sensor is oscillating high and low you probably have a cat problem should be steady state in closed loop.
I would have to agree with fuel pressure and a also a compression check. The valve seats are suspect in these engines due to quality control issues, thanks Daimler, mechanical side of injectors, read dirty, can be a problem in any car causing lean condition compensated by more throttle %.
 
Plugged cats would surely throw a code and would noticeably affect power and faulty 02 sensors that have a significant effect on air fuel ratio would also surely throw a generic trouble code as well (not manufacturer specific in either case). What is hard to diagnose are manifold absolute pressure sensors (MAP) or mass airflow sensors (MAF) since detecting out of range is somewhat difficult and it takes special driving conditions to get that code much of the time. I believe your Magnum had the MAP sensor but in either case, people that install K & N air filters are usually looking for trouble with those sensors since they tend to over-oil the air filters, which in turn degrades those sensors in particular. So you may be running rich under most driving conditions, thus affecting your mileage, and without a trouble code. More recent vehicles have improved MAP or MAF sensor diagnostics. You might want to spend the money to have a competent tech take an in depth look at the real time diagnostics the OBD II system provides. The OBD II system will hook up to a PC and the techs can look at the outputs of a multitude of sensors and spot the faulty ones. I believe there is a pretty competent OBD II tech in Arizona, but I would have to make a phone call or two during the work week to get his contact info Chris if you would like.

Also, with the hotter weather now compared to when you first got your Magnum, heavy use of air conditioning could easily drop your mileage by 2 -3 mpg.

Steve
 
Has it ever had a fuel injection cleaning? Should have had at least one and maybe two by now.

This is my thinking. I have a 94 Caravan with a 3.3 and my mileage has taken a dump as well. I also believe that the E15 gas I get doesn't help either as that's when the whole problem started. I have yet to do anything about cleaning them. Good Luck
 
Plugged cats would surely throw a code and would noticeably affect power and faulty 02 sensors that have a significant effect on air fuel ratio would also surely throw a generic trouble code as well (not manufacturer specific in either case). What is hard to diagnose are manifold absolute pressure sensors (MAP) or mass airflow sensors (MAF) since detecting out of range is somewhat difficult and it takes special driving conditions to get that code much of the time. I believe your Magnum had the MAP sensor but in either case, people that install K & N air filters are usually looking for trouble with those sensors since they tend to over-oil the air filters, which in turn degrades those sensors in particular. So you may be running rich under most driving conditions, thus affecting your mileage, and without a trouble code. More recent vehicles have improved MAP or MAF sensor diagnostics. You might want to spend the money to have a competent tech take an in depth look at the real time diagnostics the OBD II system provides. The OBD II system will hook up to a PC and the techs can look at the outputs of a multitude of sensors and spot the faulty ones. I believe there is a pretty competent OBD II tech in Arizona, but I would have to make a phone call or two during the work week to get his contact info Chris if you would like.

Also, with the hotter weather now compared to when you first got your Magnum, heavy use of air conditioning could easily drop your mileage by 2 -3 mpg.

Steve

Thanks Steve. It had the K&N in it when I bought it so I guess I'll buy a stock filter for it. I did check the cats with an inferred and they check out good. I did think about the hot weather but the decline started back in April/May when it was pretty cool here. For now I'll replace the K&N and run some fuel injector cleaner through it and see what happens.
 
what about the ethanol content of the gas you are using? has it increased lately?
 
If the car is running good and the only thing you are seeing is a little lower mileage, I would suspect the AC is the difference.

The EVIC console in my 2004 Chrysler reports about 2-3 MPG less in the hot weather with the AC running constantly. Here, that means mid-April to mid-Oct, pretty constistently.

That said, at 112k miles, I would be not be surprized that you are due for O2 sensor replacement, which defintely affects your A/F ratio and mileage.

My 2004 with rather low mileage (under 50k) needed both the crank and cam sensors replaced two years back. Experienced folks told me that is common for cars in the "Daimler Era". Sensor quality wasnt what it was back in the late 90s. Age wears them out as much miles, apparently.
 
Has your driving habbits changed in the last six months? Are you doing more city driving vs freeway driving ? Did you eliminate your air box and install one of those K&N filters that's supposed to make your car go faster ? Have you changed to a lower grade of gas ? Have you changed gas stations that you fill up at ? High ethanol gas might reduce your mileage. A transmission with a lock up torque convertor that isn't locking up could cause a drop in fuel economy. Low tire pressure could cause poor fuel economy. Dirty injectors might decrease your mileage.
 
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