For Sale It's back !1970 Plymouth Fury 70 440-6 V CODE SPORT FURY GT PROMO SHOW CAR

[tallhair]

I'm not sure if a dual snorkel air cleaner was std/available on E85 engines but it was standard on E86 engines. An optional unrestricted "No snorkel" air cleaner was available on the E86 engines, at least it was in 69 and I assume it was in 70/71 as well..

The unrestricted "no snorkel" air cleaners last year was 69. 70 B bodies had dual flat snorkels unless they had the fresh air hoods.

FYI in 68 even 383 and 440 HP engines had dual snorkels in California instead of unrestricted air cleaners due to noise and or pollution laws

 

[69CoronetRT]

The only thing I want to ad is the "K" code in 1969 is a base 440-350HP, UNLESS it is in a fleet/police application, where it is called the "Commando Pursuit" 440 rated at 360HP. Similar as the "base" 440, but not the same.

If it matters,.... I do believe the 1970 Plymouth brochure does incorrectly list the standard engine in the 70 Sport Fury GT as the Super Commando 440, but it wasn't equipped that way. T code.

Got any documentation on this package such as police specific part numbers as to why a Plymouth "police engine" was an uprated E85 K code and not a down rated E86 L code? Due to the limited application, it makes more sense to me it was a down rated L code. It would seem there should be a different cam or something similar to the differences between the E85 and E86 engines.

Something I just noticed...I have no DK E85 cars on file. They are all E86. I have no PK E86 cars. They are all E85....research continues.

 

[69CoronetRT]

The unrestricted "no snorkel" air cleaners last year was 69. 70 B bodies had dual flat snorkels unless they had the fresh air hoods.

What did the air cleaner on a 70 Hemi or 6 pack Charger look like? ;)

 

[tallhair]

What did the air cleaner on a 70 Hemi or 6 pack Charger look like? ;)

I was replying to a post about E85 and E86 440's ;)

 

[69CoronetRT]

I was replying to a post about E85 and E86 440's ;)

View attachment 79152

I know. But a 70 Hemi Charger or 6bbl car had neither flat snorkels nor a fresh air hood. ;)

 

[1978 NYB]

I know. But a 70 Hemi Charger or 6bbl car had neither flat snorkels nor a fresh air hood. ;)

This may help you Doug....

Nick's Garage - Air Cleaner Identification

 

[tallhair]

I know. But a 70 Hemi Charger or 6bbl car had neither flat snorkels nor a fresh air hood. ;)

They were also neither an E85 or E86 440 4 BBL engine which is what shooter65 was talking about or at least that's my impression ;) So I didn't feel the need to restate that in my reply since I quoted the specific question I was replying to

I know you are much smarter than I and unfortunately I seem to be missing your point so perhaps you could enlighten me as to my error.

 

[Fury Pursuit]

I don't doubt you know what you are talking about but it just seems completely contrary to logic that Plymouth would make a 70/71 GT model Fury and not put the 375 HP version motor in it as the standard engine during the height of the Muscle years, prior to 72 anyway when they started more of a sport package thing w/ lower compression motors then later package only ie later 70's road runner and R/T F bodies with 318 2 bbl engines.

So I'm just surprised.

You are not alone in being surprised.

But the facts are the facts. There are only two engines available on the 70 Sport Fury GT, 440 T code, and 440HP 6BBL V code.

1971 GT there was only one engine U code 440HP Super Commando.

It was likely a decision made by Chrysler Corporate, to make the 300 Hurst an attractive option. You had to go big, (V-code 6BBL 390HP) or take the 350HP T code. To make it more confusing, the T code engine came from the factory with a "Super Commando" air cleaner tin, but it wasn't a "Super Commando" engine. "Just" a 350HP T-code.

 

[Fury Pursuit]

Got any documentation on this package such as police specific part numbers as to why a Plymouth "police engine" was an uprated E85 K code and not a down rated E86 L code? Due to the limited application, it makes more sense to me it was a down rated L code. It would seem there should be a different cam or something similar to the differences between the E85 and E86 engines.

Something I just noticed...I have no DK E85 cars on file. They are all E86. I have no PK E86 cars. They are all E85....research continues.

Man,.....are you gonna make me dig up the factory documents? I can if it's a must have...

I have seen PK E86 K code cars, and PK E85 K cars, they do exist.

The PK E86 K code fleet engines are called "Super Commando Pursuit", 375HP. The E85 K code fleet engines are "Commando Pursuit" 360HP.

To make it more confusing, if you have an E85 engine in a "police" car, that doesn't necessarily mean it's a 360HP "Commando Pursuit". It could be a "standard" 350HP.

I don't know about the cam or internals of each engine. But I have one in my garage that is 100% original. I'm going to tear it down one day and find out!

 

[fury fan]

It was likely a decision made by Chrysler Corporate, to make the 300 Hurst an attractive option. You had to go big, (V-code 6BBL 390HP) or take the 350HP T code. To make it more confusing, the T code engine came from the factory with a "Super Commando" air cleaner tin, but it wasn't a "Super Commando" engine. "Just" a 350HP T-code.

But with dual exh, so the engine is a T but the hp would seem to not be 350. Somewhere years ago I thought I saw 360, which would match the Pursuit engine you mentioned.

I made a similar suggestion years ago on a forum about marketing of Fury vs Hurst, and one of the older guys who was around back then scoffed at that, suggesting that Chrysler didn't really push the Hurst. Regardless, I wonder if the T-code decision was based more that Plymouth was traditionally the low-priced line. That doesn't really make sense either, as E86 went in Roadrunners in 69-71, though. I would think the price difference between a Plymouth and a Chrylser would make it prohibitive to get someone to step up just to get the E86. Even to a non-Hurst model. We'll probably never know the reason.

I don't know about the cam or internals of each engine. But I have one in my garage that is 100% original. I'm going to tear it down one day and find out!

1 easy thing to check would be the harmonic balancer to see if it's externally-balanced like the 70-71 E86 and E87. And valvesprings - it might have the red-colored HP valvesprings? I thought I read something somewhere that the 360hp Pursuits were std cam but HP springs???

 

[WorkerBee]

I'm curious to see any colour 4BBL engine photos of an unmolested '70 SFGT ?

 

[fury fan]

I don't know if they were unmolested, but of the old ebay listings for 70 SFGTs I looked at yesterday, here are the pics. The blue engine is in a red car with a mashed quarter that recently went to a member in EU.

I would say it's typical for engines to incorrectly get changed to orange, but probably not the other way around.

When did the blue start vs the prior turquoise?

 

[tallhair]

When did the blue start vs the prior turquoise?

Orange went to Blue for BB HP in 72 but I'd be guessing on turquoise to blue

 

[WorkerBee]

Orange went to Blue for BB HP in 72 but I'd be guessing on turquoise to blue

For the 1970 model year, all motors went to blue with the exception of the E55 340, E63 383, E74 426, E86 440 and the E87 440-6.

 

[tallhair]

For the 1970 model year, all motors went to blue with the exception of the E55 340, E63 383, E74 426, E86 440 and the E87 440-6.

Yes those BB motors you listed are all Big Block HP engines. Like I said all BB HP engines went to blue in 72.

Thanks for filling in the rest of the info to answer his question WorkerBee.

 

[tallhair]

So you disagree that Big Block HP engines went to blue in 72 samplingman?

 

[billyfury]

You are not alone in being surprised.

But the facts are the facts. There are only two engines available on the 70 Sport Fury GT, 440 T code, and 440HP 6BBL V code.

1971 GT there was only one engine U code 440HP Super Commando.

It was likely a decision made by Chrysler Corporate, to make the 300 Hurst an attractive option. You had to go big, (V-code 6BBL 390HP) or take the 350HP T code. To make it more confusing, the T code engine came from the factory with a "Super Commando" air cleaner tin, but it wasn't a "Super Commando" engine. "Just" a 350HP T-code.

This is correct.

billyfury, 70-71 Fury collector

 

[1978 NYB]

Mopar Engine Paint Color Guide 1960-1974 - MyMopar.com

Mopar Engine Paint Color Guide 1960-1974
Engine Paint Color Guide


Engine Years Variations Color Mopar Part Number
170 Six 1960 non Valiant Turquoise P4120752
170 Six 1960- 69 Valiant Red P4349218
198 Six 1973 All Blue P4349217
225 Six 1960 non Valiant Turquoise P4120752
225 Six 1970-74 All Blue P4349217
273 V8 - LA 1964-69 All Red P4349218
318 V8 - Poly 1960 All Silver P4529148
318 V8 - Poly 1962-66 All Red P4349218
318 V8 - LA 1967-69 All Red P4349218
318 V8 - LA - Police only 1968-70 Police engine H-Orange P4349216
318 V8 - LA 1970-74 All Blue P4349217
340 V8 - LA 1968 All Red P4349218
340 V8 - LA 1969 All Turquoise P4120752
340 V8 - LA 1970-71 All H-Orange P4349216
340 V8 - LA 1972-73 All Blue P4349217
360 V8 - LA 1971-74 All Blue P4349217
361 Golden Commando 1960 High Performance Red/Gold P4349218 / P4529149
361 V8 1962-64 All Turquoise P4120752
383 V8 1962-69 All Turquoise P4120752
383 V8 1970-71 All Blue P4349217
383 V8 HP/Police 1969-71 High Performance H-Orange P4349216
400 V8 1972-74 All Blue P4349217
413 V8 1962-63 All Orange P4120751
413 V8 1964 All Turquoise P4120752
413 V8 1965 All Orange P4120751
413 V8 Race Engine 1964 Race only Orange P4120751
426 V8 Wedge 1963 All Orange P4120751
426 V8 Wedge 1964 All Turquoise P4120752
426 V8 Wedge 1966-68 All Turquoise P4120752
426 HEMI 1964 Race only Orange P4120751
426 HEMI 1965-71 Street Engine H-Orange P4349216
440 V8 1966-69 All Turquoise P4120752
440 V8 HP/Police 1969-71 High Performance H-Orange P4349216
440 V8 1970-74 All Blue P4349217

 

[mr. fix it]

It would be quite the project, I hope someone buys it and the resto ends up documented here. If the engine code for the 6BBL is V, the 5th digit right? What is the 375hp 440?

Where is the original 6BBL 440/trans package??

Unless I am really wrong here in my books if it isn't with the car then this is nothing but rolling rusted scrap.. it will never be the same car ever or worth the $$$ if it is not a matching car. end of sentence!
Feel free to correct me if I am and really missing something here..

This is nothing but a memory of what once was a great rare optioned C body.
Reminds me of Miss Belvedere...
A great car with lots of expectations and hope but at the end of the day, it is dead...
Major difference is the Miss B had a huge conductibility draw

 

[1978 NYB]

I agree....what good is having the carcass and the VIN if the original drivetrain is long gone.